Unlock Self-Awareness and Personal Growth with Life Coaching

[0:00] hello welcome and Namaste welcome Kam G
[0:03] for my career Journey podcast where we
[0:06] go deep into your career Journey what
[0:08] you offer and how people can connect
[0:10] with you thank you for having
[0:14] me so with that I wanted to give Mike to
[0:17] you to talk about what you do your
[0:21] services and then we will talk about how
[0:23] your typical day look like sure yeah so
[0:27] what I do is I work with people one to
[0:29] one
[0:30] on helping them understand themselves on
[0:33] a deeper level but really what it is
[0:35] that I'm doing is giving people the
[0:37] Judgment free space to dive into either
[0:42] beliefs or stories that they've been
[0:44] telling themselves that have been
[0:46] operating in the background that they
[0:48] haven't been aware of bring those things
[0:50] to the awareness that they can actually
[0:53] take committed action to move themselves
[0:55] forward so it it really is it's the
[0:58] antithesis or the opposite of saying
[1:00] this is wrong with you and instead oh I
[1:03] giving you space to say I understand
[1:05] myself better with this understanding
[1:08] how do I want to move myself forward
[1:10] what steps do I want to take to live
[1:12] into these goals that I have for myself
[1:14] awesome and I know many people need that
[1:18] many people around me at my work at my
[1:21] friend Circle they are almost like
[1:24] autopilot mode where they're living the
[1:27] life that Society has selected for them
[1:30] and with their training from every year
[1:33] they go to the next grade and from
[1:36] elementary to Middle to high school they
[1:39] have this pattern that they are working
[1:41] and then every few years they get some
[1:43] kind of promotion and then they get cars
[1:46] and house but in that they lose what was
[1:49] the inner drive that they had when they
[1:52] were kids so I'm excited to have that
[1:56] conversation I want to ask what your
[1:58] typical day and week look like
[2:01] well my typical day I start pretty much
[2:03] 8:30 in the morning and I'm meeting with
[2:06] clients most of the day in between
[2:09] client sessions I do spend my time
[2:11] either uh recording my own little mini
[2:13] cast or I do put a lot of blog articles
[2:16] out so a lot of my day is also spent
[2:17] writing but the majority of my day
[2:19] really is spent on these onetoone
[2:21] sessions as of right now I don't offer
[2:23] group sessions because I have found that
[2:25] I'm the work that I'm doing with
[2:27] individuals is so impactful because they
[2:30] have that space that they can count on
[2:32] week in and week out to do that deeper
[2:34] work so that's generally how I spend
[2:35] most of my days now when I'm not working
[2:38] I am also a mom so I am Mom to five
[2:42] they're not all five little ones my
[2:43] oldest is 22 and my youngest is 10 but
[2:46] when I'm not working I'm generally sound
[2:48] doing something in my mom
[2:52] world that's really awesome I want to
[2:56] take you to your own journey is how did
[2:59] you discover that this is the life this
[3:02] the coaching life coaching and
[3:04] everything that you do is this is for
[3:07] you that is such a great question
[3:09] because my path to where I am was not
[3:11] linear I was definitely as you described
[3:15] very linear expectation focused right so
[3:18] Elementary Middle High you go on to grer
[3:22] education and then go on beyond that and
[3:24] so I actually entered the business world
[3:27] as a project manager worked with my up
[3:30] to become a project management office
[3:32] like manager so I was managing the
[3:34] entire project office but in those roles
[3:37] I kept coming back to really supporting
[3:40] the individuals so yes it was about the
[3:42] project and managing the project but my
[3:45] strong part or what I really enjoyed was
[3:48] talking to the the people the resources
[3:50] and saying okay tell me more of what you
[3:51] need how can we get you to to grow and
[3:54] expand I kept coming back to that once I
[3:57] left so that was a doom world and of
[3:59] course as that came crashing down I had
[4:01] to Pivot I actually ended up building in
[4:03] managing a law practice not because I'm
[4:05] an attorney but because I understand the
[4:07] management and the operations right so I
[4:09] once again found myself in the
[4:11] management perspective but over again I
[4:14] kept going back to the people part of it
[4:16] the people the clients as well as the
[4:18] people at the firm what do you need how
[4:21] can I support you what is it that you
[4:23] will help you grow and evolve so that
[4:25] was professionally what was happening
[4:26] for me I mentioned my kids when I was
[4:29] this was about 10 years ago at this
[4:31] point between 10 and 15 years ago they
[4:34] were my baby was definitely baby but the
[4:36] middle ones were entering this pre-teen
[4:38] stage teenage stage and they were
[4:41] starting to exhibit a lot of people
[4:43] pleasing perfectionist Tendencies so I'm
[4:46] very tip Bay I know this about myself
[4:48] but what they were mirroring back to me
[4:51] was another part of myself which I
[4:53] hadn't really paid a whole lot of
[4:55] attention to and that was the
[4:57] perfectionist people prising part of me
[4:59] so I actually recognized that they were
[5:02] showing up this way because that's what
[5:03] they were learning from me and as I made
[5:07] that connection I realized I needed to
[5:09] go through some deeper self-awareness in
[5:12] terms of where that was coming from for
[5:14] me so that I could shift and pivot again
[5:17] but pivot in terms of parenting so that
[5:19] my kids wouldn't necessarily repeat the
[5:22] same patterns that I have because I
[5:23] could see it wasn't serving them
[5:24] especially in the social perspective so
[5:28] I did that work and as I went that work
[5:30] I recognized that this is what I was
[5:33] actually meant to do I was meant to go
[5:35] through this process for my own self for
[5:37] the fact that I wanted I I could show up
[5:39] differently as a parent but actually
[5:41] this was what I was called to do was
[5:43] take this experience and this journey
[5:45] from that personal experience
[5:47] perspective and match it with I what I
[5:49] was enjoying professionally in terms of
[5:51] the people side of things and bring
[5:53] those two worlds together and to and
[5:55] from there recognize that I wanted to
[5:57] work with people one-onone and just Dove
[6:00] head first into understanding that could
[6:01] come through coaching people and so went
[6:04] through the certifications for life
[6:05] coaching but then took it even further
[6:07] and got really deep into different
[6:09] modalities getting trained into
[6:10] different modalities because of course
[6:12] each of us as individuals learn things
[6:14] differently right so some of us are very
[6:16] linear thinkers we can do things
[6:17] cognitively that's how we assimilate the
[6:19] information other people don't they need
[6:22] more access from a a bottomup approach
[6:25] so I also wanted to get trained in the
[6:26] sematic approach tell me what your body
[6:28] is fearing because that would give us
[6:30] information and then once you understand
[6:32] that you can understand it cognitively
[6:34] so to answer your question in a very
[6:36] long-winded way and I apologize for that
[6:39] it it wasn't linear for me but really
[6:41] what it was taking pieces of what I was
[6:43] enjoying from a professional standpoint
[6:45] recognizing that I went through a
[6:46] personal experience that was meaningful
[6:48] on many levels and I could bring those
[6:50] to Two Worlds together and now help
[6:52] other people do this
[6:54] self-reflection because I have found
[6:56] that so often and you and I were
[6:57] chatting about this that so often people
[7:00] don't really do that self-reflection
[7:02] they're just they're doing the check
[7:04] boxes and they're doing the things on
[7:05] autopilot and they don't have the
[7:08] awareness of what's really driving them
[7:11] or where their real value system is and
[7:13] so helping people recognize that allows
[7:15] them to then chart their course as I
[7:18] really want it what an incredible story
[7:21] and I'm so glad that I asked you that
[7:24] because that gave so much insight and
[7:27] you said people pleaser and
[7:29] perfectionist in the same world and it
[7:32] sound like it's not possible but it is I
[7:34] am that one of that person that I just
[7:37] have that realization re recently but
[7:41] like powerful just do that yeah and
[7:45] that's the thing too is I realize with
[7:46] my people pleasing and my perfectionism
[7:48] I that's for me personally I was dimming
[7:51] myself down a lot meaning I would defer
[7:53] to what other people wanted instead of
[7:56] maybe what I needed because I wanted to
[7:58] make sure that they were happy okay and
[8:00] then of course perfectionism because if
[8:02] they were unhappy then that means I must
[8:05] have failed somehow right now I'm not a
[8:06] good person so it can really hold you
[8:09] doing the things that you really want in
[8:10] the business world we see it all the
[8:12] time where people will maybe not go up
[8:14] for a promotion because of they don't
[8:17] want to step on someone else's toes for
[8:19] instance right because they think I'm in
[8:21] this group I'm in this team and now this
[8:24] promotion is available but then they
[8:25] won't apply for the promotion because
[8:28] they don't want to necessarily step on
[8:29] their other teammates toes and somehow
[8:32] they feel like somehow they would be
[8:34] overstepping perhaps so it comes up in
[8:36] different ways for sure wow that was
[8:40] actually a practical example that I can
[8:42] resonate I have seen this I've seen
[8:44] actually this in the corporate world I
[8:47] will introduce you to somebody named
[8:49] Leilani she was the director of pmo
[8:52] office Advent Health where I work and
[8:55] now she moved to Universal another
[8:57] company where she does some writing some
[9:00] business coaching so I will I I think
[9:02] you guys will enjoy talking to each
[9:04] other so I will do that I will introduce
[9:05] oh that'd be great that'd be great and
[9:08] then you talk about some certification
[9:10] I'm just curious which one you did so I
[9:13] have done different certifications in
[9:15] terms of specific certifications like in
[9:17] somatic coaching and somatic healing
[9:20] I've done certifications in things like
[9:22] new money story certifications in life
[9:24] coaching in Wellness coaching
[9:26] certifications in things like conscious
[9:28] uncoupling as well calling in the one I
[9:30] also certified to work with teenagers
[9:33] and kids so I've done certifications in
[9:34] teen life coaching as well as with
[9:36] called adventures and wisdom which is
[9:38] life coaching for kids but then the
[9:40] trainings I've done also include
[9:42] cognitive behavioral based coaching
[9:44] acceptance and commitment based coaching
[9:46] internal family systems based coaching
[9:48] and then of course I'm certified in
[9:49] breath work in meditation and
[9:51] mindfulness so I've covered the gamut
[9:54] first of all I'm a nerd to begin with I
[9:55] love to learn these things but also the
[9:58] deeper reason why is because I recognize
[10:00] we're all so different and so one
[10:02] modality might work for one person but
[10:05] not for another and for instance
[10:07] meditation might not resonate with
[10:09] somebody but they can get their arms
[10:11] around mindfulness because there's
[10:12] slight distinctions between the two and
[10:15] then I actually stumbled on breath work
[10:16] for myself and realized wow this is
[10:19] lifechanging because it's a completely
[10:21] sematic based practice but when you go
[10:24] through a breath work session all of
[10:26] this emotion starts coming out of you
[10:27] and you realize wow I've been holding on
[10:30] to so much and I didn't even realize it
[10:32] and it's all using your body to release
[10:34] it that's why I love yoga because it
[10:37] encompasses meditation exercise and
[10:40] breath combination of all three yeah so
[10:44] I will talk about one more thing before
[10:46] we move to this the next segment is your
[10:48] journey from project management to is uh
[10:52] something what I have been going through
[10:55] at my work I manage I have managed
[10:57] project but for Last 5 Years a managing
[11:00] product and agile transformation and I
[11:03] felt like the same logic same practices
[11:06] can apply to a person so a person
[11:09] product and Company Founders same thing
[11:13] and then you can you can just go with
[11:15] your goals and quarterly planning and
[11:17] your Discovery and your MVP as your
[11:21] professional and personal growth you can
[11:23] apply many of the same logic there yeah
[11:27] you absolutely can it's so funny because
[11:28] people some look at me strange and say
[11:30] you a project manager and now you're a
[11:32] life coach yeah there's a lot of synergy
[11:34] though because the way that we set up a
[11:36] project in order to be successful really
[11:39] it translates we're just doing it with
[11:41] life instead and we're doing it with
[11:42] personal as well yeah yep
[11:46] 100% all right so let's get deep dive
[11:49] into we going to just pick a scenario
[11:53] which I'm hoping will help you
[11:55] illustrate how you do things and whoever
[11:58] is watching will a to see that how this
[12:01] works so let's say if a person who is
[12:03] your client how and come for a discovery
[12:07] session how does it work I will tell you
[12:09] a story okay before we start this about
[12:12] four or five years ago my company gave
[12:16] me a executive coach Nikki an amazing
[12:20] person the engagement was like the goal
[12:23] for that session or that coaching was to
[12:27] me to to enhance my executive presence
[12:30] or build my executive presence so that I
[12:33] can be ready for a director position M
[12:36] that engagement last for 10 month okay
[12:39] we done a lot of writing we
[12:41] brainstorming so many things happen in
[12:43] that 10 month and the result was I
[12:46] realize that I am done with the
[12:49] corporate letter and I don't want to
[12:52] become a director want to do something
[12:55] different something bigger than myself
[12:57] something bigger than the corporate life
[12:59] can provide me which is helping people
[13:02] like just like you helping people
[13:04] helping build great product I don't know
[13:07] exactly what but it started with people
[13:10] so I had that real life experience
[13:14] myself that how this can change and
[13:18] address The Root Drive that you have so
[13:21] highly recommend that and with that I
[13:23] want to hand over Mike to you that how
[13:25] does these session work for somebody who
[13:28] comes to you yeah also that's such a
[13:31] great example and I love that was your
[13:32] life experience that's amazing so when
[13:35] working with me the way that any
[13:37] relationship starts always starts with a
[13:39] very first initial phone call where we
[13:42] really just have an opportunity to
[13:44] understand what it is that the
[13:45] individual is looking for what it is
[13:47] that where are they in life and where is
[13:48] it that they want ahead and the reason
[13:51] why that conversation is so important at
[13:52] the gecko that first initial call is to
[13:55] make sure there's the right sit because
[13:58] the one thing that I hold myself really
[14:00] truly accountable for is that the space
[14:03] that my client and I create together
[14:07] needs to be a space that they know that
[14:09] they can count on no matter what it's a
[14:13] judgment free safe space and so that
[14:16] starts with that first phone call to say
[14:19] I want to know you and I want you to
[14:20] know me and let's deal into do we
[14:23] resonate with each other because for me
[14:26] personally in any relationship I have
[14:28] emotional safy
[14:29] is number one priority because I believe
[14:32] that you can't really get to really know
[14:34] somebody and really be vulnerable with
[14:37] them if I don't have emotional safety
[14:38] and so again I hold myself accountable
[14:40] for creating that space But want my
[14:42] client to feel the same so that's the
[14:44] number one thing that I start with after
[14:46] that I do engage very similar you said
[14:48] 10 months yeah I engage with my clients
[14:50] for six 12 months sometimes longer
[14:53] because what we're doing is we are
[14:57] creating a rediscovery of self and
[14:59] realigning that relationship with self
[15:02] because so often we and especially as a
[15:04] high achiever myself I spent years just
[15:06] doing and every accomplishment was where
[15:09] worthiness came from and so the shift
[15:11] that I'm really working with my clients
[15:13] on is accomplishments are amazing and we
[15:15] absolutely celebrate them but let's come
[15:17] back home to self who are you as an
[15:19] individual outside of the
[15:21] accomplishments or the things that
[15:22] you're doing and really re-engage with
[15:25] what's important to you what do you
[15:27] value what's meaning F to you what are
[15:29] your needs that's a big one especially
[15:31] as the people of twer we tend to not
[15:32] know what our needs are and also a lot
[15:35] of the work that I do with my clients is
[15:37] bringing to the awareness maybe some
[15:39] limiting beliefs or some old narratives
[15:41] that are no longer serving us so for
[15:43] instance I'm for me personally I
[15:45] definitely had a book a narrative around
[15:48] wanting to make sure that I was pleasing
[15:51] other people because for me that created
[15:54] a space of feeling accepted and
[15:56] belonging this is a very old narrative
[15:59] film when I was younger I was brought up
[16:00] in a predominantly white town in
[16:02] Connecticut and 5-year-old me wanted to
[16:04] fit in and she that comedy solv that by
[16:08] making sure that I did what other people
[16:10] made sure they were happy oh you want
[16:11] this let me help you with that you need
[16:13] this let me help you why because it gave
[16:15] little comedy a sense of belonging
[16:17] little comedy then assimilated that that
[16:18] became part of my being and became part
[16:20] of my narrative so in my adult years I
[16:22] recognized oh that's an old narrative
[16:24] and it served me when I was a little
[16:26] girl but now that narrative is actually
[16:28] holding me back that narrative is not
[16:30] allowing me the room to maybe go off and
[16:32] create this life coach practice right
[16:35] because I'm worried about what other
[16:37] people are going to need or making sure
[16:39] they're okay so that's a lot of the work
[16:41] that I'm doing with my clients really
[16:43] helping them truly understand themselves
[16:46] themselves right because it's about the
[16:47] relationship with self understand
[16:50] yourself create that relationship and
[16:52] then determine what it is that you want
[16:54] whether it be professionally or
[16:55] personally so giving even your example
[16:57] it was wow over this 10 months I
[16:59] realized I'm actually resonating with
[17:01] the corporate ladder maybe that was an
[17:04] external expectation maybe that was just
[17:06] a narrative that was assimilate but as
[17:08] you went through the work and you
[17:09] started rediscovering self it sounds
[17:10] like you recognize wow the thing that
[17:13] really is Meaningful to me is doing
[17:14] something different outside of this and
[17:16] that's what the coaching is about is
[17:18] creating that space to say okay what is
[17:20] it that you really want what really will
[17:21] bring you that joy and then what steps
[17:24] are we going to take that's part of the
[17:25] coaching too is now we put committed
[17:27] action in place in order to would you
[17:29] accountable to take steps towards those
[17:30] goals and in this session in in your
[17:33] response one of the thing that you said
[17:36] is about limiting belief right this
[17:39] thing is so huge that nagging voice that
[17:43] always tells you what you can do what
[17:46] you cannot do and your unconscious mind
[17:50] especially conscious unconscious mind
[17:53] that directly or indirectly make
[17:55] decisions for you just based on what
[17:57] happened in your childhood
[17:59] oh yeah oh most often we're not it's
[18:02] unconscious it's completely happening on
[18:05] autopilot yeah such a powerful thing and
[18:09] I have many of those I'm I have a coach
[18:12] who is helping with Hypno and it's
[18:15] amazing that how I was able to go to my
[18:18] childhood different situation and able
[18:21] to connect the dots and she's amazing
[18:23] she's connecting the dot between what I
[18:26] believe what are the problem that I'm
[18:28] facing and how they are connected how
[18:31] the wires are connected to those
[18:32] situation is so powerful many people
[18:35] don't know this like this life coach and
[18:39] many other services like they don't know
[18:41] about it so I want to ask as you were
[18:45] saying there are so many certification
[18:46] that you have done same thing there are
[18:49] so many ways you help other people it's
[18:52] life coach is just one of the word but
[18:55] there are many I want to ask and explore
[18:59] that how do people identify what do they
[19:02] need yeah such a great question and
[19:05] you're I think you're absolutely right
[19:06] people a lot of people don't know the
[19:08] concept of life coach or if they hear it
[19:10] they're like that seems weird I know how
[19:12] to do life I don't need a coach for this
[19:15] so especially when you see 19y old and
[19:19] 22 years old life coaches yeah yeah yeah
[19:22] that's very true that's very true
[19:24] saturated and then you have all
[19:26] different type of people and and that's
[19:28] such a good point is that you do have a
[19:30] lot of people so can understand a little
[19:32] bit of the a little bit of the
[19:35] questioning and the cynicism around it I
[19:37] absolutely want to be respectful of that
[19:39] however there's definitely a lot of us
[19:41] coaches out there who have done a lot of
[19:43] training and work and then we have our
[19:45] own life experience but life coaching
[19:48] isn't telling you how to do life right
[19:50] so it's not about that the way my role
[19:53] is I see myself as a co-collaborator in
[19:56] holding this really Sacred Space for my
[19:59] clients to again discover for themselves
[20:01] and to have those insights and the way
[20:03] it's done is in how I show up I actually
[20:06] a beautiful testimonial that was
[20:08] completely given to me completely
[20:10] unasked for but I actually work at one
[20:12] of my clients as a therapist and she
[20:13] actually left me this beautiful message
[20:16] about how the space that I hold is so
[20:20] powerful that what she has noticed is
[20:23] not just the ships in herself but as a
[20:26] therapist herself she's noticing that
[20:29] she's now showing up differently with
[20:31] her clients and and they're having these
[20:34] great results and so she was sharing
[20:35] with me in this beautiful way she wanted
[20:37] me to know that not only what I'm doing
[20:40] with her is benefiting but it's actually
[20:43] trickling down and it gave me gooseb and
[20:45] I did get a little teary because I was
[20:46] like wow that's so powerful but that's
[20:48] what coaching is about it is about
[20:50] creating the space for people to explore
[20:52] things that they don't have space in
[20:54] other areas of their life and it is
[20:56] different from therapy but and I
[20:58] absolutely believe in therapy 100% but
[21:01] coaching is different from therapy in
[21:02] the sense that therapy is more leans
[21:05] towards diagnosis and like really coming
[21:08] to an understand I say diagnosis but not
[21:10] in a negative way it's like giving a me
[21:12] to what's going on and then coming up
[21:14] with a plan to work through that problem
[21:16] and I absolutely believe in therapy
[21:18] coaching is different in the sense that
[21:20] it leans towards decision I want I'm
[21:23] making a decision to change something or
[21:25] move on something and then I'm going to
[21:27] put these action items in place so the
[21:29] distinction is more diagnosis versus
[21:31] decision the way that I approach
[21:33] coaching is and the way that I talk
[21:35] about it is I don't pathologize I help
[21:38] people understand and that's the
[21:40] distinction that I make with people what
[21:43] coaching is all about again is creating
[21:45] that space to figure out what it is you
[21:47] want for yourselves and then how are how
[21:50] what steps are you going to take in
[21:51] order to move yourself forward it is so
[21:54] important to recognize though that it's
[21:57] difficult you can take steps forward so
[21:59] for instance like you mentioned there's
[22:00] so many different types of coaches and
[22:03] it's important that people recognize
[22:04] that sometimes like maybe there's a diet
[22:06] coach and they give you really things
[22:08] that you can Implement and and habits
[22:10] you can put in place which is great and
[22:12] really powerful the thing to remember
[22:14] though is that there are other types of
[22:16] coaches who who go on that deeper level
[22:18] and say instead of just doing these
[22:20] things that we're going to put in place
[22:21] let's go underneath and figure out what
[22:23] are the driving factors on a personal
[22:25] intimate level and then from there put
[22:28] these things in place if that makes
[22:30] sense I think you covered such a great
[22:34] distinction between a mentor and uh
[22:38] coach right coach help you find answer
[22:42] that are already there versus Mentor
[22:46] like I'm five step ahead of you this is
[22:50] the path that I have taken will work for
[22:52] you if you want to follow right almost
[22:55] like that kind of distinguish they're
[22:56] telling you what to versus coach is
[22:59] helping you find your own answer Inside
[23:03] Yes and of course and of there's some of
[23:05] us who maybe dabble and both only offer
[23:07] that because I do work with some
[23:08] teenagers and emerging adults and
[23:11] sometimes they do need a little more of
[23:12] the mentoring than just the coaching
[23:14] because they haven't quite had enough
[23:15] experience to figure out what it is from
[23:17] within themselves they need a little
[23:19] more guidance around it sometime I use
[23:21] the word more handholding get to your
[23:24] label where you can start thinking
[23:26] deeper yeah yeah with that actually as I
[23:29] brought developers into the mix let's
[23:32] say a developer from web developer or a
[23:36] database developer two to five year of
[23:39] experience if they want to get live
[23:44] coaching or some kind of coaching number
[23:47] one will it help them in way I know it
[23:51] will I know it will but
[23:53] I pr tell them and how I absolutely
[23:58] believe it can help anybody as a matter
[24:00] of fact I'm a coach and I have a coach
[24:02] because I believe the best coaches have
[24:03] coaches but it will because even if you
[24:07] want to move forward professionally our
[24:10] personal world and how we think and how
[24:12] we see ourselves that is the underlining
[24:16] if you think of it like a house that's a
[24:17] foundation and everything else is built
[24:19] upon it so where you are going
[24:22] professionally right you got to look at
[24:24] that Foundation piece and so if you go
[24:26] and you work with a wife coach and you
[24:28] you understand yourself better you
[24:29] understand your values you understand
[24:31] your motivators I do a lot of motivation
[24:33] work with my corat that will help you
[24:36] understand where it is you might want to
[24:37] go next in terms of your career or with
[24:40] developers sometimes they feel stagnant
[24:41] or stuck they're like I'm in this role
[24:44] what's next I don't know impostor
[24:46] syndrome can come into play a lot of
[24:48] times if you're working on a very
[24:49] complex project there's a lot of
[24:51] pressure especially in development
[24:53] because there's a lot of time pressures
[24:54] and then of course do I know enough
[24:56] about the code all these things so can
[24:58] Coster syndrome can come in again life
[25:00] coaching can help you understand what
[25:02] are those narratives or beliefs where do
[25:04] they come from Once you bring that to
[25:05] the awareness now you start working
[25:07] through it what's actually true and you
[25:09] start breaking those down and that'll
[25:11] give you more confidence in your
[25:13] professional world as well yeah and that
[25:16] can open up a lot of door for them yeah
[25:19] oh yeah just what they want to do and
[25:22] what they could do absolutely what's
[25:25] possible what's possible yeah what's
[25:27] possible so let's continue the
[25:29] conversation keeping developers and also
[25:31] startup Founders in mind they typically
[25:35] have a very stressful job many hours
[25:37] that go by and sometime they don't even
[25:39] take breaks so what's your advice yeah
[25:43] that's such a great topic I coach so
[25:45] many people around this because I
[25:47] generally work with a lot of high
[25:48] Achievers right and by high Achievers
[25:50] it's people who are working these long
[25:52] hours are pushing themselves that
[25:53] they've got these goals for themselves
[25:55] and so what ends up happening is the
[25:57] stress and the anxiety stress around I'm
[26:00] overwhelmed I've got too much to do or
[26:02] I'm worried about potentially failing or
[26:04] missing a deadline anxiety also I'm
[26:07] anxious about being able to deliver I'm
[26:09] anxious about not wanting to
[26:11] fail one of the things that I talk a lot
[26:13] about with my clients is this concept of
[26:15] self-compassion self-compassion is uh
[26:19] based off of Kristen nef and Chris
[26:20] gummer's work which says there's three
[26:23] pillars to it one is kindness over
[26:25] judgment the second is common human
[26:29] and the third is mindfulness so what do
[26:31] those mean kindness over judgment is
[26:33] saying even if something doesn't go the
[26:36] way that I wanted it to go right even if
[26:38] it's an outcome that I'm not happy with
[26:40] the inner critic or the Judgment mindset
[26:42] to run the show saying oh you're
[26:44] terrible you totally messed that up
[26:48] people are going to think you you don't
[26:49] belong here that would be the judge the
[26:51] Judgment mindset instead we lean into
[26:53] kindness which says even if this thing
[26:56] didn't end up the way that I wanted it
[26:58] to to what can I take from this
[27:00] situation how can I learn and what can I
[27:03] learn and what can I apply going forward
[27:06] that second pillar of common humanity is
[27:07] a really important one because so often
[27:11] if we feel like we've messed up or
[27:12] something isn't going the way that we
[27:14] want it to go we will self-isolate we
[27:18] will go within we will say nobody
[27:20] understands I can't share this with
[27:21] anybody almost in a form of self shaming
[27:25] common Humanity says no other people
[27:28] have had similar
[27:30] experiences we can talk about it we can
[27:32] talk about it and you can ask them how
[27:35] they may have worked through a situation
[27:36] so it's the opposite of isolation and I
[27:39] say that common humanity is really
[27:40] important especially in the context of
[27:42] shame because what happens when we
[27:45] isolate and go inside and and say
[27:47] there's something wrong with me that's a
[27:49] form of Shame and every time that we
[27:51] shame ourselves we're going to make
[27:52] ourselves smaller and smaller and then
[27:54] we don't we don't actually allow
[27:56] ourselves to grow and expand and to move
[27:59] forward so that second pillar of common
[28:01] humanity is just really important to
[28:02] recognize that it is okay to share this
[28:04] with other people and then the third one
[28:06] is mindfulness so often we're so
[28:08] scheduled we're go I've gotten this
[28:10] deadline I've my family all of the
[28:12] things mindfulness says come back to the
[28:15] present moment 47% of our day is either
[28:18] spent in the there or the then meaning
[28:21] we're either future focused and worried
[28:23] about what's going to happen or we're
[28:25] ruminating over the past so mindfulness
[28:27] show come back to this moment right here
[28:29] and right now what's in front of me
[28:31] right now and how do I want to move
[28:33] forward in this moment with what's in
[28:35] front of me I offer this idea of
[28:37] self-compassion especially in the
[28:39] context of this world that we live in
[28:41] right now that feels very stressed out
[28:43] very anxious and burnout is a huge issue
[28:46] across the board and I can only imagine
[28:48] that developers are having the same
[28:50] feelings of burnout where it's I'm
[28:52] actually overe exhausted I can't I I
[28:55] almost can't function anymore
[28:57] self-compassion is a great way to work
[28:59] through that in the sense of you lean
[29:01] into kindness over Judgment of self you
[29:03] ask others for support and you come back
[29:05] to the present moment what can I handle
[29:07] In This Moment rather than worrying
[29:09] about the future or worrying about what
[29:11] happened in the past thank you that's a
[29:15] great advice that can definitely help
[29:18] people you you use the word high
[29:20] achiever but developers High achiever
[29:23] bonders that they can tap
[29:25] into and hopefully reduce the stress and
[29:29] have a more Balanced Life right well I
[29:32] mean especially if you think about I
[29:34] mean developers and Founders but
[29:35] Founders I'm thinking just as an
[29:36] entrepreneur myself there is a lot of
[29:39] pressure around success or I need this
[29:42] thing to succeed because I've put
[29:45] everything into it for instance or I've
[29:48] invested not just time but money um My
[29:51] Blood Sweat and Tears type thing that's
[29:53] a lot of internal pressure so how do we
[29:56] deal with that self compassion is a
[29:58] great tool to the thing is is people
[30:01] will say especially with anxiety too
[30:02] they'll say I just want to stop feeling
[30:04] anxious well first of all if you were
[30:06] able to just stop feeling anxious you
[30:08] would have done it already but also it's
[30:10] part of The Human Experience so instead
[30:13] how do you work within it within the
[30:14] human experience so it doesn't overwhelm
[30:16] you and overtake
[30:18] you yeah definitely and then I'm I'm
[30:21] going to switch to a similar but a
[30:24] slightly different topic people who are
[30:26] working in corporate War as we started
[30:29] that discussion that people are in they
[30:31] have some kind of autopilot from
[30:33] elementary to Middle to high to college
[30:35] and then that's what they expect in
[30:37] their corporate work and then in their
[30:39] life at some point they will buy car and
[30:42] and house right these are all the thing
[30:44] that happens and people who have spent
[30:47] some time in corporate world they get
[30:50] their dreams and vision and project from
[30:53] corporate so they don't have to think
[30:55] about what to do somebody's telling them
[30:59] and then they
[31:01] execute in all that most people I'm just
[31:05] going to make that comment a statement I
[31:08] I'm not sure if 100% true or not but
[31:11] most people or many people do not know
[31:14] what they want from their life they do
[31:16] not have the dream that what is that
[31:20] they're working for one I want to
[31:22] validate is that the true thing and then
[31:24] second how do you help them how do
[31:27] people can find it
[31:29] yeah I'm know I haven't done the the
[31:30] full research either but I'm guessing we
[31:32] could find some research on it because I
[31:33] believe based on my clients and I've
[31:35] worked with that's been the case for
[31:37] sure is that they've living I call it
[31:40] living to external expectations right so
[31:42] this this is what's expect of you yep
[31:44] check the box and the next level and
[31:46] it's all laid out for you and so there's
[31:48] not a whole lot of agency personal
[31:51] autonomy put into that and so a lot of
[31:54] the work that I'll do with clients is we
[31:56] do things like values work
[31:58] like really understanding what are your
[32:01] core values and most of the clients that
[32:04] I end up working with are shocked by the
[32:06] exercise and they realize oh my gosh
[32:08] commedy I have never done this before
[32:10] I've never slowed down to ask myself
[32:13] what are my values because what ends up
[32:15] happening is we take on usually our
[32:18] family of Origins values or maybe our
[32:20] culture sometimes Society we just take
[32:22] those on as ours we don't ever slow down
[32:25] to do an evaluation for ourselves
[32:27] because we are following this linear
[32:28] path that's been laid out for us we get
[32:30] to the corporate world and again it's
[32:32] like you mentioned ladder this you go to
[32:34] this rung and then this rung and this
[32:35] Rong this is how you do it there's never
[32:37] a self-reflection moment of what is it
[32:41] that I actually value what is it that I
[32:43] actually want what is it that I actually
[32:45] need what is it that actually brings me
[32:47] joy when I'm doing X Fillin the blank I
[32:52] feel in flow or I feel joyful or I feel
[32:56] connected to myself we we don't slow
[32:58] down to do that so those are the types
[33:00] of conversations that we're also having
[33:02] that we can start understanding what are
[33:04] your passions what are the things that
[33:06] really actually light you up what are
[33:08] the things that make you laugh and then
[33:10] of course what are the things that you
[33:12] value without those things for instance
[33:15] I mentioned emotional safety is a core
[33:17] value of M another core value of M right
[33:19] now is family and and motherhood they're
[33:22] intertwined with each other but those
[33:23] are the things that without those I
[33:25] would not be who I am right so knowing
[33:28] what those core values are those are the
[33:30] things that will help you regain your
[33:32] own agency so that you're not just on a
[33:35] path almost designed for you but you're
[33:37] starting to write your own
[33:38] blueprint and I want to go one level
[33:41] deep there the question that you was
[33:43] asking what excite you what is your
[33:45] passion what what make you trigger how
[33:48] do people respond to that I feel like I
[33:51] don't know if they know this yeah so
[33:53] funny they usually say I don't
[33:55] know what are you talking about and so
[33:58] we we really go into things like I'll
[34:00] ask my clients when was the last time
[34:02] you just found yourself
[34:03] laughing what were you doing when was
[34:06] the last time that you lost track of
[34:08] time and what were you doing because if
[34:10] you lose track of time and you're and
[34:13] you look back and you say oh I was doing
[34:15] a b or c that means that you were in
[34:18] flow doing a or C you weren't paying
[34:21] attention to time you were just in your
[34:23] being working on something that'll give
[34:26] us some information right so you ask
[34:28] different types of questions because
[34:30] right if I say to somebody what's your
[34:31] passion they haven't thought about it
[34:33] their whole life they're going to make C
[34:34] me I have no idea so you have to go
[34:36] about it in a different way that's what
[34:38] coaching does it says let me see what
[34:39] other questions I can ask in order to
[34:42] help you have those insights that about
[34:44] things that you never really took up
[34:46] took time to evaluate
[34:49] before and if somebody find that what
[34:52] they are passionate about or what
[34:54] trigger them is different then what the
[34:58] job that they're doing right then how
[35:02] what happened what do we do yeah I think
[35:04] for some people it's then about creating
[35:06] time to be able to have room for the
[35:09] passion and then also room for the thing
[35:11] that they that's bringing them income
[35:14] you that's an option some people are
[35:15] like I can make that happen and I feel
[35:17] good about that I'm still doing my
[35:19] passion thing but I'm also bringing an
[35:20] income with something that I don't mind
[35:22] I I'm not miserable doing it I can do
[35:24] both sometimes people realize wow my
[35:27] passion is the thing that's really
[35:28] calling to me and I really don't find
[35:32] any joy in this work that I'm doing so
[35:35] then we have deeper conversations around
[35:37] is there a way to bring your passion
[35:39] into potentially shifting your vocation
[35:42] or your profession how could we maybe
[35:44] it's not a full shift maybe it's can we
[35:46] bring that passion into what you're
[35:47] doing is there a segue can we bring it
[35:50] can we somehow infiltrate drop pieces of
[35:53] what you're passionate into what you're
[35:54] doing because maybe that's an option if
[35:55] not then maybe we start talking about
[35:57] segue into something different that
[35:59] you're more aligned with and passionate
[36:00] about because sometimes we do we find
[36:02] that we've been in a role that we're not
[36:04] really happy about we're just going
[36:05] through the motions of the day and we
[36:08] really don't want to do it anymore
[36:09] because we feel like we're not actually
[36:10] engaged in our life and so then we get
[36:12] creative about how can you make that
[36:14] shift into what actually lights you up
[36:17] and I'm going to go right back to you
[36:21] you had that realization at some point
[36:23] and then you switch so how did that how
[36:27] did you do that and how did did that
[36:29] feel like like it it required a lot of
[36:32] Courage absolutely people will ask me I
[36:34] actually just asked this morning what
[36:36] was the bravest thing that I ever have
[36:37] done in terms of my business and I said
[36:41] starting because it was a huge pivot and
[36:44] it would for me too it's it was scary
[36:46] because I was being called to do this
[36:48] but I had some people in my world that
[36:50] weren't sure of it right they were they
[36:53] had their own fears around it and also
[36:54] their own opinions about what I was
[36:56] trying to do and that took a lot of
[36:58] Bravery to just stand and say no this is
[37:00] what I'm passionate about and also this
[37:02] is what I want to create in terms of
[37:05] what I do on a daily basis day in and
[37:07] day out I don't want to be doing this
[37:08] other stuff anymore so yes bravery
[37:10] courage for me I was ready like I I
[37:14] learned what I was passionate about and
[37:16] then I gave myself the grace to figure
[37:18] out can I do both or is it that I really
[37:21] want to lean into this one and when I
[37:23] came to that conclusion I then said okay
[37:25] how do what steps do I want to take so
[37:27] wasn't like I just one day woke up and
[37:29] said I quit and I'm doing this other
[37:30] thing it was a process to move into it
[37:33] for me that worked for some people maybe
[37:35] it would work to just rip off the
[37:36] Band-Aid one day but I needed the step
[37:38] by step because I tend to be slightly
[37:40] risk averse so that's how I approached
[37:42] it myself so how long you did you do
[37:45] those two things side by side I think
[37:48] what I ended up doing was I I started to
[37:51] set up my coaching practice and I gave
[37:53] it about I want to say about four months
[37:56] where I was just in Both Worlds and then
[37:58] when I got to four months I said okay
[38:00] I'm ready I I'm ready is nothing like
[38:03] you did yeah it wasn't a lot at all for
[38:05] me I and that's what I say like I had
[38:07] really come to personally I had come to
[38:10] a recognition that this is what was
[38:12] really calling to me it was so strong
[38:15] that the fear that may have been there
[38:17] started to diminish as I gave myself
[38:19] more and more permission to step into it
[38:21] so about four months I think four to six
[38:24] months I had transitioned completely
[38:25] into full-time this is my this is what
[38:28] I'm doing so I'm going to share that I'm
[38:31] in that boat right now where I have been
[38:34] in corporate world for 24 years okay I'm
[38:37] making this public statement right now
[38:39] I've been 24 years and I love this job
[38:42] because the work that I do is entire
[38:46] endtoend product development and I have
[38:50] this amazing opportunity where I can tap
[38:53] into whatever area that need help and
[38:56] where I want to actually work so I I get
[38:59] a lot of enjoyment a lot of energy from
[39:02] this work and now I'm building the side
[39:05] business of coaching business so far
[39:08] it's been two years where I've been
[39:09] building the skills and everything and
[39:11] now I'm the point where I'm getting
[39:14] traction and I need more deeper into
[39:17] this and I'm at this place that how to
[39:20] do this and you talk about people around
[39:22] you and I have people around me my
[39:25] significant people around me without
[39:26] taking name who feel scared that
[39:32] anytime she sees the possibility of me
[39:35] leaving this job and doing this full
[39:38] time where I'm not earning any money I'm
[39:40] doing it for out of I started out of my
[39:43] passion and writing
[39:47] passion and uh where sometime you need
[39:51] that support and you feel like you're
[39:52] are spending too much energy convincing
[39:55] somebody who is not able to see Vision
[39:58] will be there 2 three years from now or
[40:01] whatever the tip frame is so you gone
[40:03] through the exact same thing I believe
[40:06] so what is your advice to me how did you
[40:08] do it and what's your advice to people
[40:11] like me I especially because I'm a
[40:13] people pleaser I had to do that inner
[40:15] work with that was like okay separation
[40:18] between what my vision is and what they
[40:22] how they're showing up and their fears
[40:23] that they have for me and it wasn't
[40:25] saying one's right and one's wrong was
[40:27] saying I just acknowledge that this is
[40:30] what Their Fear is and then it was about
[40:32] reminding myself that's their fear I
[40:34] don't have to take that on his mind and
[40:36] also the truth is if I try this thing
[40:39] and it doesn't work I'm not letting go
[40:41] of all this expertise I already had I
[40:44] can always shift back if I really want
[40:46] to by doing this new thing I'm not
[40:48] suddenly going to forget how to do all
[40:50] the things that I've already been
[40:51] trained and doing for me also it was
[40:53] like almost 20 years not going to lose
[40:55] that so was a bit of self trust that
[40:58] needed to be developed too where it was
[41:00] like I'm okay and I just have to tell
[41:02] the people around me is I understand
[41:04] your fear I think it's totally valid
[41:07] that you feel afraid I'm going to do
[41:09] this thing though and I know that even
[41:11] if it doesn't work I have other means I
[41:14] can always fall back in what I've been
[41:15] doing and my expertise that I already
[41:17] have and then it's about releasing it
[41:20] and allowing them to work through their
[41:21] own fear it's not mine and I would offer
[41:23] that same to you is that it's not yours
[41:25] to alleviate that fear
[41:27] it's not person's to work through it
[41:30] yours is to work through your
[41:32] own okay and then what about my own
[41:36] belief of having this stable job that
[41:39] I've been into 18 years actually right
[41:43] and then trying to build something that
[41:45] I don't even know what the two year
[41:48] three years from now there again there
[41:50] is limiting belief there's the critic
[41:53] voice in your in your head I think what
[41:56] it is for you is it it is about noticing
[42:00] and naming your own limiting beliefs and
[42:05] so for me let me just shift it from you
[42:07] for to me for a minute I had my own
[42:09] fears about it it was naming out what is
[42:12] it that I'm afraid of and how am I
[42:13] scaring myself noticing the limiting
[42:15] beliefs for me was around fear of
[42:18] failure as a perfectionist once you name
[42:21] that out it's even if the worst thing
[42:23] happens and it completely
[42:26] flocks what would I do and for me the
[42:29] answer was I'd go back to what I know
[42:32] and I would just do that again if that's
[42:34] worst case scenario I go back to what
[42:36] I've been doing so I would offer the
[42:39] same things like to work through your
[42:40] own Lim places call them out name them
[42:43] but then say okay how am I afraid how am
[42:46] I scaring myself and then ask that
[42:48] really important question I was like
[42:49] okay so then what what would I
[42:51] do most probably it'll be something
[42:53] similar where it's I can always go back
[42:55] to what I've known for the last 18 plus
[42:56] years
[42:57] it because that expertise doesn't go
[42:59] away that doesn't go away yeah that's
[43:02] what I will be using yeah I know we have
[43:05] one minute over we'll go to right to the
[43:07] last question what's your message to the
[43:10] audience oh my message to the audience
[43:13] is this it is give yourself permission
[43:17] to do some of the
[43:19] self-reflection reflection can be
[43:21] sometimes a little bit scary because we
[43:23] might be afraid of what we'll uncover
[43:25] but doing self-reflection will actually
[43:27] give you such an internal power in order
[43:30] to regain agency over your own self an
[43:34] agency over your life where is it that
[43:36] you want to head and so you can set your
[43:38] own goals for yourself not the ones that
[43:39] are given to you by other
[43:42] people thank you so much Kam for coming
[43:46] on my podcast as a guest I really
[43:47] enjoyed I got so much information for
[43:50] myself so thank you so much for that
[43:52] thank you thank you for having me
[43:54] [Music]