Apple Genius to Backend Web Developer in 3 Years - Carlos's Remarkable Career Transformation (Ep:37)

[0:00] welcome Carlos thank you for my career
[0:02] Journey podcast
[0:03] I started it about a year ago and the
[0:07] purpose behind it to bring the stories
[0:10] of different people and show how their
[0:13] career has shaped over over time and now
[0:18] focusing on the web developers so you're
[0:21] perfect
[0:22] a person to show the journey
[0:26] um so let me welcome Carlos Carlos
[0:29] started his career as a genie member of
[0:32] Apple team characters and then from
[0:35] there he joined Advent Health as an
[0:39] intern and then he started his journey
[0:42] as a programmer in our team three years
[0:45] ago and now he is a crucial member of
[0:49] the back-end team and he can handle
[0:52] fronten as well and now you're moving
[0:56] from java to.net
[0:59] awesome so welcome welcome thank you
[1:01] thank you for having me
[1:04] um I want to start by asking what is
[1:08] your career Journey look like
[1:10] that's an interesting one um originally
[1:13] for college
[1:15] um I always had kind of like this
[1:16] inclination for Arts but growing up I
[1:19] was always around computers so I needed
[1:21] to figure out a way of kind of including
[1:22] both of them and graphic design was like
[1:25] the perfect field to go into uh so I
[1:28] kind of dive in head first into that
[1:29] field like these two things are
[1:31] beautiful you know kind of learning more
[1:33] like web development color TV all of
[1:36] those things but eventually once you
[1:38] start to get into the market of like hey
[1:40] are you really enjoying this one
[1:42] particular career that's when I started
[1:44] hiring some doubts I was like it's fun I
[1:46] love it but not as much as something
[1:50] that can actually make me do something
[1:52] that can someone else use yes graphic
[1:55] designer can create an image it's used
[1:57] but it it's not the same impact as I
[1:59] kind of creating an app or a website
[2:01] where someone can actually just use it
[2:02] on a daily
[2:04] um so I ended up working for Apple
[2:05] because graphic design was not really it
[2:08] did not end to really be in my calling
[2:10] but being at Apple it allowed me to work
[2:12] with computers and then it allowed me to
[2:14] actually get an internship with them
[2:17] um that kind of opened my eyes to the
[2:20] whole programming side
[2:21] and at the beginning or anything
[2:24] internship with Apple for coding correct
[2:26] yes so basically what they do is they
[2:28] allow like uh internal employees to say
[2:30] hey we would like to do an internal
[2:32] internship for you guys so you guys can
[2:34] see what corporate looks like actually
[2:36] encrypted with teams and for some that
[2:39] actually becomes like an interview
[2:40] process for it for me it was more kind
[2:42] of a discovery because I was like I'm
[2:44] really interested in coding but I know
[2:45] nothing
[2:47] uh so it was it was very interesting to
[2:49] kind of go and see and see all of these
[2:51] processes especially from a bigger
[2:52] company uh like apple but that just kind
[2:56] of sparked something in me this is a hey
[2:57] I kind of like setting up all these
[3:00] instructions and kind of have this do
[3:02] this for me over here and then I kind of
[3:04] get a result from that and that just
[3:06] sparked like this whole roller coaster
[3:08] that actually led me where I'm at right
[3:10] now
[3:10] so from there how did you join Adventure
[3:15] so first thing that you need to do is
[3:17] kind of like get back into school and
[3:18] kind of like learn this new process of
[3:20] how to be in a programmer uh and with
[3:23] that a very close friend of mine I was
[3:26] working at I've been hell at that time
[3:27] and I was like hey I am looking for an
[3:29] internship can we talk
[3:32] lucky enough he was able to give me that
[3:33] internship and shout out to college yes
[3:37] definitely thank you so much
[3:39] um but basically it all becomes it comes
[3:41] down to like networking like if you're
[3:43] able to know someone that person might
[3:45] be able to just give it a little help
[3:47] um that you need to actually just get
[3:49] into the industry uh for me what this
[3:51] was and what this actually turned into
[3:53] was a three-month interview process I
[3:56] was uh for three months yes I was an
[3:59] interview internship no no no oh after
[4:02] the internship turned into basically a
[4:04] three-month kind of like interview okay
[4:07] because basically the work that I did
[4:09] during this three months ended up being
[4:11] kind of like the reflection or kind of
[4:13] like my I see what yeah because when I
[4:15] went in and said hey I would like to
[4:17] apply for this position I see okay um so
[4:19] kind of doing that internship like
[4:21] people will get to know you people will
[4:22] get to know you more on a personal level
[4:24] uh they'll get to know your work and
[4:26] that will open even more doors
[4:28] eventually because once you network with
[4:30] someone you're slowly started to get
[4:31] into Network and slowly expand yeah yeah
[4:36] so how is your last three years in
[4:40] Advent health and programming book life
[4:42] it's been very interesting it's been a
[4:44] growing path and growing career
[4:48] um there's been some like ups and downs
[4:49] but eventually it's just being a
[4:51] learning opportunity like non-stop
[4:53] learning non-stop everything like since
[4:56] I became like from The Internship all
[4:58] the way to this where I'm at right now
[5:00] everything is just being learning
[5:01] learning and learning and just kind of
[5:03] growing and absorbing more just the kind
[5:05] of the ecosystem that we have going on
[5:07] right now when you join you didn't have
[5:10] the programming programming knowledge
[5:11] right no I didn't have like all the the
[5:13] programming knowledge that I know right
[5:15] now it's mainly what I learned from
[5:17] school is just kind of like the basics
[5:18] but once you get out into the real world
[5:20] things are slightly different you know
[5:22] in in a class will tell you hey have
[5:24] discounted until 10.
[5:26] eventually we'll get to the point that
[5:29] uh at work they might not tell you that
[5:30] so things start to get a little more
[5:32] challenging you start to look into new
[5:34] things you certainly learn new
[5:35] technologies and then yeah it like I
[5:38] said it just becomes this learning thing
[5:40] a day really yeah so what all you know I
[5:43] know you know Java springboard Java uh I
[5:47] learned how to use batting which is a
[5:49] framework of java okay that when you're
[5:52] running it actually creates its own
[5:53] JavaScript to then create a website for
[5:55] it so it's a whole new framework that I
[5:57] actually learned when I was at work yeah
[5:58] this is that's the the internal support
[6:01] tool that we use it uses that framework
[6:02] oh I see so it allows me to code in like
[6:05] back-end and it automatically creates
[6:07] this website for me
[6:09] um so it's a very it's very easy for a
[6:12] back-end developer to just kind of Say
[6:13] Hey I want to get this application going
[6:15] without having to involve too much of a
[6:17] front end okay
[6:20] um some JavaScript react right uh
[6:23] Android that was basically kotlin that
[6:26] was another one so you did Android it's
[6:29] it's I didn't do Android but I had to
[6:31] troubleshoot things related to Android
[6:32] the good thing about Android is that
[6:34] they're very it's Java so when you're
[6:37] gonna you're kind of going through this
[6:38] code it gets very familiar fairly quick
[6:40] uh minor things changes so things will
[6:43] start to just get very familiar at the
[6:44] end okay and then now you're learning
[6:47] Darkness yes right now it's Darkness C
[6:50] sharp uh that that's another interesting
[6:52] one uh once again like once you're gonna
[6:55] get the idea of what coding languages
[6:58] actually do you start to see them like
[7:00] hey at your core you guys are the same
[7:03] minor things here context you know
[7:05] syntax starts to change but once you get
[7:08] an idea I'll have you can read the logic
[7:11] you're able to see code in a different
[7:13] way than allows you to kind of say I
[7:15] barely understand this I have an idea
[7:16] what is going on and then you can start
[7:18] diving in
[7:20] so now you know Java springboard
[7:23] um
[7:26] and now.net correct um
[7:30] I always say that once you know one
[7:32] language the second language is easier
[7:34] did so you just said that how different
[7:38] a Java and c-sharp in your opinion
[7:42] fairly different
[7:43] um C sharp eventually not I'm just
[7:47] learning C sharp so forgive me for
[7:49] whatever reason but in Java I feel like
[7:52] I have to write more lines of code just
[7:54] to kind of get the same result that I
[7:55] get with fewer lines and C sharp uh so
[7:58] for me it's being kind of like an
[7:59] experience of like wait did I just I
[8:01] just finished this this does not look
[8:03] right because it looks like the logic
[8:05] should look bigger but in reality when I
[8:07] run it and the program is just working
[8:09] fine it was very surprising for me just
[8:11] to kind of say
[8:12] hey very similar really on how I have to
[8:14] build a logic but code wise and the
[8:17] length of lines that I have to write it
[8:19] starts to get shorter those are
[8:20] interesting
[8:21] say you're promoting C sharp indirectly
[8:24] indirectly and directly and this is just
[8:26] because right now I'm working with it so
[8:28] my brain is just full of yeah exactly
[8:30] shiny object right now other than that
[8:33] I'm not really sure how we've been a
[8:34] couple years from now are you using
[8:36] Mozilla Studio or code no I'm actually
[8:38] using brighter from IntelliJ a reason
[8:40] why I switched to that turns out that uh
[8:42] IntelliJ which is another ID for Java
[8:47] the main parent is jet brains and it
[8:50] allows you to actually sync your
[8:52] settings from 180 to the other one so oh
[8:55] it does yes so it was easier for me to
[8:56] just say hey I'm going to use a new IDE
[8:58] okay but with all my custom settings I
[9:01] already had before okay so the adoption
[9:03] of switching to our new program it
[9:06] wasn't really kind of like oh my God I
[9:07] gotta spend a couple days learning it I
[9:09] don't know how it does all the debugging
[9:12] and everything but uh I think if you do
[9:15] Visual Studio
[9:16] full flesh visual wow that's a slightly
[9:20] different experience so I don't know if
[9:22] you will try it I mean the only thing is
[9:24] like we have Max so oh it's working like
[9:27] yeah there's a video for Mac yeah it's
[9:30] not as full flash as the actual official
[9:32] studio icic and so sometimes when you're
[9:35] reading documentation straight out it
[9:37] just tells you this is not part of
[9:38] Visual Studio Max so menus were
[9:41] different uh but writer and Visual
[9:43] Studio for Windows are able to actually
[9:46] get the same kind of like libraries so
[9:48] that allows me to just say hey I can get
[9:50] the same library for what I need rather
[9:52] than having to use the other visual
[9:54] studio for Mac that does not
[9:56] okay
[9:58] so I want to ask you
[10:01] you've been here for three years
[10:04] you started when you have no idea but
[10:07] the programming and all logic and now
[10:10] three years
[10:12] you you have you single-handedly
[10:15] handling couple of tools like support
[10:17] tools right and uh so
[10:22] I'm sure there are a lot of a lot of
[10:24] things that you have learned a lot of
[10:25] different things that you have done so
[10:27] work brought you some knowledge you
[10:30] probably have done your own uh things so
[10:34] what that learning looked like like how
[10:37] if you have to highlight couple of
[10:39] things for last three years from the
[10:42] learning perspective what are those and
[10:44] how did you kind of go after them
[10:47] So reading documentation is a huge thing
[10:50] I mean it's better to get the
[10:52] information from the people that created
[10:54] what you're working with from anywhere
[10:56] else uh but besides that there's there's
[10:59] tons of communities where like you know
[11:01] you can read the documentation from
[11:02] Microsoft but the problem is still
[11:04] slightly different or it's just one
[11:06] minor thing that they're not talking
[11:08] about uh so going out there and actually
[11:10] doing the research and having
[11:12] conversations with different developers
[11:13] and everything
[11:14] might not get you the solution but it
[11:17] may get you into the right path and like
[11:19] as long as you keep continuing and going
[11:20] into the right path you eventually
[11:22] relating to the solution okay uh but
[11:25] ideally is always you know be access
[11:27] questions you know learn figure it out
[11:30] why that needs to happen and how you can
[11:32] get it done
[11:33] okay so when you was when you started
[11:35] learning Java or uh that other thing or
[11:39] yeah
[11:40] if I didn't I will remember that now
[11:43] um
[11:44] so they're probably the initial couple
[11:47] of months when you just start learning
[11:50] and then there are a couple of months or
[11:53] years when you're mastering it
[11:55] so so I want to ask you first when you
[11:58] start learning something new what's your
[12:00] steps what's your process usually I try
[12:04] to duplicate a project
[12:06] you know what I mean so it's like let's
[12:08] say we're learning something new it's
[12:09] like how can I manually
[12:11] reproduce this you know give an example
[12:15] so for example what we're doing right
[12:16] now with C sharp you know uh
[12:19] didn't know how to do C sharp you know
[12:21] trying to learn the context sometimes
[12:23] reading it works out once for me writing
[12:26] it like actually start writing code and
[12:28] kind of creating like a hello world kind
[12:30] of like application right this gets me
[12:32] going like cool like I understand this
[12:34] concept okay let me add another concept
[12:36] like how about if I add a different type
[12:38] of response or I don't say hello world
[12:39] but I have to do some logic and I might
[12:41] age you know so that small process of
[12:44] like let me just physically do something
[12:46] first gives me that confidence to say I
[12:49] understand this particular process now
[12:51] yeah I can then start adding to that
[12:53] it's the same project correct yeah so
[12:55] add more and more correct I just start
[12:57] adding more so grab whatever project
[12:59] you're working on if you were you're
[13:01] working on something just get really
[13:02] comfortable with that particular Port
[13:05] because once you understand how this
[13:07] works how the code works with this you
[13:09] can then add in a little bit more on top
[13:11] or use the same kind of like analogies
[13:13] and and thought process that you put
[13:15] into this one right so then do it over
[13:17] here in this one okay and how do you
[13:19] bring the structure meaning you don't
[13:24] two things and then you know that there
[13:27] are at least 30 50 more things so that's
[13:30] that's
[13:32] a little complicated because like it's
[13:35] sometimes you do have to do a lot of
[13:37] like physical changing code manually but
[13:40] for example this example actually I can
[13:42] give you would be when I did spring boot
[13:43] it was a significant jump on versions uh
[13:47] yeah so there were a lot of annotations
[13:48] that would change or that were you know
[13:51] old and they were out of circulation uh
[13:53] so basically when did it happen is I had
[13:55] to go in and replace uh using the idd
[13:58] the IDE they do have an option to say
[14:00] hey fine and replace uh so for example
[14:03] if I needed to do a particular change
[14:04] that involved 30 different items to be
[14:07] the same thing I will first do one make
[14:10] sure that one's working once I validated
[14:12] that that one was working then I was
[14:14] able to say hey highlight everything
[14:16] that says this and replace it for this
[14:18] okay and that allowed me to then do all
[14:21] of them but first I got one down once I
[14:24] got that one down
[14:27] okay and then you create kind of table
[14:30] of content or kind of curriculum that
[14:33] this is what I will follow I will learn
[14:35] functions and variables it's it's now in
[14:38] my head but it's it mainly starts with
[14:41] kind of like how can I get that hello
[14:42] world going first so like hey how can I
[14:45] get words first and then I once I figure
[14:48] out how to get words out then I can just
[14:49] be like hey how can I get numbers out
[14:51] now I got numbers I can do both of them
[14:54] without an error how can I do a date now
[14:56] how can I do a date number and yeah like
[14:59] yeah text right so like once you once
[15:02] you start kind of like that just gets
[15:03] the ball rolling and you're like cool
[15:05] and also gives you a little bit of
[15:06] confidence of saying hey I understand
[15:08] this now I can learn a little bit more
[15:10] because if you jump into something
[15:12] really complicated but you don't
[15:14] understand kind of like the basics
[15:16] it kind of throws you off but again the
[15:18] stuff on my head is I just start with
[15:19] the basics you understand the basics
[15:20] cool let's move into something a little
[15:22] bit more harder okay cool we got to a
[15:24] point where like now we're really
[15:25] understanding the code that we're seeing
[15:27] everywhere online or reading the
[15:29] documentation now we can make the big
[15:30] jump to what we're working on yeah
[15:33] last question on this
[15:35] um there are so much videos and courses
[15:39] and free stuff are available
[15:42] how do you pick which one to follow
[15:46] it's really hard it's really hard okay
[15:48] so at the end of the day there's so many
[15:50] different ways you can tackle the same
[15:51] problem yeah uh and and the best way to
[15:55] actually do it is and I learned this
[15:56] from Scott Russell it's the rule of
[15:58] Threes like when you come like do you
[16:01] have a problem right in front of you
[16:02] don't just go like oh I found the
[16:04] solution it's like you need to come up
[16:06] with three solutions minimum that means
[16:09] that like you find your first solution
[16:10] yep you're like all right let me see
[16:12] another way of actually doing this and
[16:13] let me find a third way about actually
[16:15] doing this well eventually you'll find
[16:17] out is that all three of them work but
[16:19] one of them gives you a little bit more
[16:21] headaches in the future than the other
[16:22] ones will it takes longer to actually
[16:24] resolve the issue but it takes no issues
[16:27] for the future so you get to discover
[16:30] all those three different areas before
[16:33] you apply it okay yeah awesome so we
[16:37] talk about how Carlos use the learning
[16:41] the top method like it's start with the
[16:44] hello world and then add more and more
[16:46] and then go to the advanced topic yeah
[16:49] awesome
[16:51] now in three years you also kind of
[16:55] progressing toward becoming a senior uh
[16:59] developer you already are I mean to my
[17:01] mind you already are you're handling
[17:02] things independently what does it look
[17:06] like
[17:07] um from the thought process what do you
[17:10] think different
[17:13] from the point when you started for six
[17:15] months or after six months and now after
[17:17] three years I mean when I started for me
[17:20] it was
[17:21] um you know how the horses have the
[17:23] little eye shades that's how I felt when
[17:25] I was a junior I was like you're working
[17:29] that's it
[17:31] once I became like an intermediate it
[17:34] was more like hey the changes that
[17:36] you're doing need to be like you know
[17:38] you need to have conversations with
[17:39] people because what you're doing might
[17:40] be affecting someone else and like if
[17:43] you don't have those conversations it is
[17:45] going to cause a problem so from Junior
[17:47] I was like hey I'm gonna fix this and
[17:49] it's fixed I'm walking away right so
[17:52] intermediate is more when kind of like
[17:53] hey the problem is a little bit bigger
[17:54] and it's not affecting your team is
[17:56] affecting a couple more teams the
[17:59] discussions are bigger so it's more like
[18:00] hey if I make this change how are you
[18:02] going to be affected right you know and
[18:05] then now that I'm kind of like in the
[18:07] process to kind of go into seniors
[18:08] grabbing all of those and then adding
[18:11] like hey now we're talking about the
[18:13] technology and what could be implemented
[18:15] like it's not as simple as saying like
[18:17] hey I'm going to make this change and
[18:18] it's not going to affect you but it's
[18:20] like hey if I'm going to be making this
[18:22] change right now is it going to be
[18:23] fixing this for now or are we looking at
[18:25] maybe three four five years ahead that
[18:27] we can have this issue resolved what
[18:29] technologies can we use right now to
[18:31] make sure that in the future this is all
[18:33] like it's set up for us in a good way so
[18:36] there's there's more thought processes
[18:38] being behind just we're all being
[18:40] affected it's more like hey you're being
[18:42] effective we're being affected we're
[18:44] gonna fix it eventually how can we make
[18:46] sure that like we're up to date we're
[18:48] running the latest and that this is not
[18:49] going to be a problem in the long run
[18:51] so after that process but at the same
[18:55] time it's it's a very interesting
[18:57] conversations that you have because you
[18:59] get very well
[19:01] and um
[19:04] there's another aspect that uh when when
[19:08] you're working on something and it's not
[19:11] working for whatever reason you don't
[19:12] know what the reason is
[19:15] what's the difference now compared to as
[19:18] a junior
[19:19] right now I literally dive in I just go
[19:22] like oh here here here here here here
[19:23] here literally Non-Stop and I go as deep
[19:26] as I can as soon as possible when I was
[19:29] a junior it was kind of like I gotta
[19:31] look for this can I look into that I'm
[19:34] not even sure if I can modify that file
[19:36] is it possible I think I made a mistake
[19:38] let me just erase everything I just did
[19:40] so it was I was very scared to kind of
[19:43] you know deep dive into this long files
[19:47] and maybe you raise one like one letter
[19:49] and just damaged the whole thing but
[19:51] nowadays I'm just gonna hey we're gonna
[19:53] go and try to figure out the sources
[19:54] right now cool this is where it's
[19:56] starting and then you start the brain
[19:58] process of how to resolve that
[19:59] particularly huge huge difference one of
[20:03] the Big Chain that I've seen in my
[20:06] um career Journey from Junior to senior
[20:08] is uh when I was Junior production
[20:11] issues kind of uh panic situation now I
[20:16] can stay calm and go methodic that it
[20:19] was working yesterday why it's not
[20:21] working what changed and I can stay calm
[20:24] and and figure out the troubleshooting
[20:27] stuff did you see the change yes very
[20:30] similar uh every time every time I see
[20:32] anything in the production chat it's
[20:34] like I need to dip dive this is the
[20:36] biggest part I've ever seen in my life
[20:37] sign all the alarms you know but that
[20:40] that only led me to just kind of like
[20:41] spend like a good 30 minutes of research
[20:44] to then someone goes like oh this was
[20:46] off yeah you know
[20:48] um so I kind of learned as you said
[20:49] methodically just kind of start asking
[20:51] those questions like why did it stop
[20:53] what changed for me yesterday to today
[20:55] or did we introduce something new that
[20:57] made those changes is everything every
[21:00] single app that we talk to every other
[21:01] like different emrs that we talk are
[21:04] they online
[21:04] you know so is all of those questions
[21:07] that start to become like the norm
[21:08] before you did die because a two second
[21:11] question can literally save you a 30
[21:13] minute maybe two three hour link yeah
[21:16] which is deep dive so definitely ask
[21:18] those questions yeah that I saw that as
[21:21] one of the major Traditions yeah
[21:24] also I less panicking like actually
[21:27] yeah as part of the becoming senior
[21:32] are you kind of setting something like
[21:36] you have to do this or that to become a
[21:41] senior like do you have some kind of
[21:43] perception in your mind
[21:44] the only kind of like perception to have
[21:46] receive is from like the people that I
[21:47] worked around you know I worked around
[21:49] me thumb and uh Todd his Stroud so yeah
[21:53] it got to a point where I was like I
[21:54] surrounded by seniors and and then like
[21:57] I said that's that's where like my idea
[21:58] of you know when you were having
[22:00] conversations as a seniors not only like
[22:02] I'm gonna fix the problem for everybody
[22:03] it's better it's more like hey we have
[22:05] this issue could it be related to our
[22:07] technology how can we go above it's not
[22:09] really that one solution you know
[22:12] um so in my thought process to just kind
[22:14] of get there and what I've done is this
[22:16] one I cannot pair up with them and just
[22:18] kind of see what they were doing the
[22:19] questions that they were asking
[22:21] um and and I noticed that like before
[22:24] like just kind of like the
[22:25] troubleshooting for like production
[22:27] measures they were not really just deep
[22:29] diving into it but these were like deep
[22:30] questions so they're like hey option A
[22:33] is not working but option b is one but C
[22:35] is the one that's actually cussing the
[22:36] program for a so it goes a little bit
[22:38] more deeper the conversations are
[22:40] sometimes outside of uh or environmental
[22:43] value and health and involving third
[22:45] parties
[22:46] so learning which questions to ask
[22:50] helps a lot to kind of especially move
[22:53] the conversation along because with
[22:55] technology you can get to a point where
[22:56] you stop but like you need to figure out
[22:58] how to move that conversation along to
[23:00] actually resolve the issue and and
[23:02] that's where you see in some of these
[23:03] senior developers is just to kind of say
[23:06] hey I need to keep this going so I can
[23:08] resolve it and once again it's not
[23:10] really about just let me deep dive into
[23:12] the code but just kind of looking at the
[23:14] issue more methodically and deeper into
[23:17] how can it affect multiple things
[23:21] do you think these uh all these
[23:24] certifications
[23:26] matters have you done any or what are
[23:29] you planning to do I right now I'm
[23:31] trying to get a certification for Azure
[23:33] since we're moving into seizure and
[23:35] everything related to Microsoft so that
[23:37] I'm looking forward to a certification
[23:39] but yes they do come in handy
[23:42] um because
[23:43] you know you can learn how to code you
[23:45] can learn all of these things like soft
[23:47] thought but
[23:48] at the end of the day companies are not
[23:51] really going to know they were
[23:52] self-taught so somehow they kind of have
[23:54] to figure out how to validate your
[23:55] skills and you know having a
[23:57] certification there could be you know a
[23:59] couple hundred dollars then land you a
[24:01] very good job yeah it's kind of worth it
[24:03] you know so
[24:05] and the good thing is that the
[24:06] certifications stay with you they're not
[24:08] part of the company it's you so it's
[24:10] skills that you're gaining and on top of
[24:12] that they're being validated by the
[24:14] person who created those videos you know
[24:16] what I mean so
[24:18] um good to have
[24:20] but just make sure that they're kind of
[24:23] like about what you're working about you
[24:25] don't want to have a certification for
[24:27] Apple but you're working related stuff
[24:29] with Microsoft like
[24:31] yeah unless you're actually trying to
[24:32] get a job with apple then yes but yeah
[24:34] you just you just got to be conscious of
[24:36] the certification
[24:38] and most company would reimburse like
[24:41] our companies Adventures World members
[24:43] yes because they see it as a as your
[24:45] growth and and let's be honest it is
[24:47] your growth if you're trying to get
[24:49] certified something is saying hey I want
[24:51] to learn and actually be really good and
[24:53] efficient at this and they can survive
[24:55] me I've been helped with CSA hey that is
[24:57] your career growth we can go ahead and
[24:59] help you with that
[25:00] so now Azure has so many certification
[25:05] which one you plan to do how you kind of
[25:08] map out how many you will do so and and
[25:12] right now because we're going to be
[25:15] introducing new Azure services and
[25:16] everything first movie that Azure
[25:18] certification so I can get an idea of
[25:20] what we're looking at and what we're
[25:21] working with
[25:22] um the other one that I'm looking to get
[25:23] is the OCTA certification because we
[25:26] work a lot with the doctors and identity
[25:28] provider on the health Suite login but
[25:32] they have certifications that kind of
[25:33] get stuff over like hey you are like
[25:36] proficient enough into all of the other
[25:38] settings and everything that we think
[25:40] you're going to be a certified developer
[25:42] for us so you getting that certification
[25:44] is also kind of one thing that says hey
[25:46] you're really good at understanding how
[25:47] OCTA works that could be something that
[25:50] we can use in the future or someone can
[25:51] hire you just straight up say hey we
[25:54] hire you because of your certification
[25:55] because we need someone that's an expert
[25:57] what would be your steps to do that
[26:00] certification like I know you're busy I
[26:02] know there's so many things going on so
[26:04] you will have to find time you will have
[26:06] to find curriculum you have to I mean
[26:08] there are
[26:09] multiple things so how would you decide
[26:14] the steps and time frame
[26:18] so the time frame is the the most
[26:21] difficult part right uh because you have
[26:23] to kind of look for the time that
[26:25] sometimes you don't have during the week
[26:26] so one of the things that I I kind of
[26:28] did is Microsoft has this kind of like
[26:30] little AI that allows you to book Focus
[26:33] time
[26:34] so it automatically just books it for
[26:36] you so now I have chunks of two hours
[26:38] where I can just basically say hey I am
[26:40] busy I'm not looking at anything I can
[26:42] just sit down and just sort of daily
[26:44] okay yeah so sometimes like you know my
[26:48] day-to-day is just not having all these
[26:49] issues but meetings and things like that
[26:52] doesn't allow us to say hey I am busy
[26:54] for two hours let me do my thing
[26:57] um but you should kind of use that time
[26:59] to kind of see like hey yeah what kind
[27:01] of what books do I need to read what
[27:02] documentation do I need to look into and
[27:05] you know what kind of tests do I need to
[27:06] take because certifications is you know
[27:08] could be winter this could be two yeah
[27:11] awesome all right so in this segment my
[27:15] last question is
[27:16] why package how did you decide that why
[27:21] I mean why you decided that how what was
[27:23] the process what is the thought process
[27:25] look like that is a very interesting
[27:26] question because honestly no one has
[27:28] really asked me that before but because
[27:31] I had a graphic design background
[27:32] already like I already did some some
[27:34] like you know web design and things like
[27:36] that so when she got to the point I'm
[27:37] like I really know a little bit of that
[27:39] but I have no idea about the logic side
[27:42] like how will this process has happened
[27:45] and then it gets shown so I kind of
[27:47] decided to just kind of take a peek
[27:49] behind the curtain and say hey show me
[27:51] how to create this logic and how to make
[27:53] this you know computer understand what
[27:55] I'm writing to then give me the solution
[27:57] of it here so that was very captivating
[27:59] for me just to kind of say hey how can I
[28:01] give you instructions to then give me
[28:04] this result
[28:05] um for this one particular application
[28:07] yeah
[28:12] um
[28:12] and I think now you're doing kind of
[28:15] both so yeah I think you're somebody who
[28:17] can go end-to-end you also have done the
[28:21] sequel right yeah okay yeah I mean it's
[28:24] it's not sort of our sequel bro but it's
[28:27] one of those things like with your day
[28:28] today you kind of have that's another
[28:29] language that you might have to learn in
[28:32] order to just kind of do your job mainly
[28:34] in the back end because there's a lot of
[28:35] queries that you might have to kind of
[28:37] read create all of that I was really
[28:40] good for me I was really good with SQL I
[28:43] was really good with t-shirt no way I
[28:45] know right what happened come on man we
[28:48] need you
[28:49] there he goes that was a problem
[28:51] he jumped to manager he's like all right
[28:54] I don't need the skills anymore
[28:56] yeah that was the biggest turn right
[28:59] yeah you use that as a stepping stone to
[29:01] become a manager and then once you
[29:02] manage it that's it that's all you need
[29:04] it in fact
[29:06] when I was manager I was still doing
[29:09] some touch with the course I I see but
[29:12] with the senior manager with this uh
[29:14] I've seen go where I'm like
[29:17] this is it's all code but like I seen
[29:20] like oh you've seen my name that's where
[29:23] it's like for a second I was like all
[29:24] right I feel like everybody has touched
[29:26] this code at this point but yeah I seen
[29:28] your name
[29:29] it's pretty interesting it was kind of
[29:31] funny because it was like yeah what is
[29:32] he doing here so I was talking to
[29:34] someone this morning his name is uh
[29:36] Craig and he's helping me with the
[29:39] course creation and one other thing that
[29:42] we discussed where should I go back to
[29:46] coding so that I can kind of share more
[29:49] practical examples with my audience
[29:53] and I've been showing some resistance
[29:55] because
[29:56] I have nine to five job I have this
[29:58] product that I'm trying to create the
[30:00] quarterly planning workbook and then all
[30:03] the writing
[30:04] there's no time for coding and but he
[30:09] suggested that you have if you really
[30:11] want to connect with the audience at the
[30:14] deeper level yeah I should do some I
[30:16] should apply that
[30:18] framework
[30:19] on myself and show that that see this
[30:23] framework work I just used it via
[30:25] quarterly planning framework work and
[30:28] others can follow I was just gonna
[30:31] suggest that it says I actually finish
[30:32] your priority thing and just say now let
[30:35] me apply it yeah and show the results of
[30:37] it yeah you know yeah so
[30:41] I was sort of finalizing but I think I'm
[30:43] gonna do react in four weeks okay now go
[30:45] for it four week finished react it's a
[30:50] I'm like you're like backend I like it
[30:53] and with asp.net I didn't not have to do
[30:57] heavy front end
[30:59] so react would be some heavy challenge
[31:03] for me yeah I mean a good thing is like
[31:05] if you're already you know do you know
[31:07] some JavaScript some jobs
[31:10] yeah no definitely it's better to know
[31:13] some language right it's so languages
[31:15] but it's always better to say hey I know
[31:17] some and kind of looking at the code and
[31:19] being like okay I got an idea of maybe
[31:21] what's happening rather than like I have
[31:23] no idea you know because that that just
[31:26] jump starts you you know it's it's and
[31:28] like I said like we were talking about
[31:29] like once you start understanding those
[31:31] minor components
[31:33] it makes it easier to just go into other
[31:35] ones I know enough to be dangerous like
[31:37] I when I was doing jQuery was something
[31:41] big so I could use it I could customize
[31:43] it I could kind of
[31:46] borrow
[31:47] as in some some other code and kind of
[31:50] make tweak to my knee so
[31:53] up to that point
[31:55] all right so with that we're gonna move
[31:58] to the next segment all right where we
[32:00] will talk about how your typical week
[32:03] and kind of weekend look like which are
[32:06] interesting because uh sometimes there
[32:08] are releases sometimes there's like
[32:09] production issues that uh here they can
[32:11] just like end up being 6 30 at 7 p.m uh
[32:15] but right now actually what I'm doing is
[32:17] I'm taking French classes on Mondays uh
[32:20] my brother is married to a French girl
[32:22] and they have a girl so I want to be
[32:25] able to communicate with my knees in
[32:27] French uh so I'm taking those classes
[32:29] like every Monday night and then
[32:32] um Tuesday all the way to Friday is just
[32:34] kind of like at home relaxing unless
[32:37] kind of to dinner with friends and
[32:38] things like that yeah weekends are just
[32:40] trying to like literally be outside of
[32:42] my house uh since I spent most of the
[32:44] time inside of it anything you say hey
[32:46] you want to go pick a strawberries list
[32:48] go you want to go to a fresh market
[32:49] let's go you know anything that just can
[32:52] get me out into the Sun and there's kind
[32:53] of like an activity I'm not that
[32:56] awesome
[32:58] and during the day yeah during the week
[33:01] how do you manage your time
[33:05] it's it's difficult because for example
[33:09] um
[33:09] you know I I like to be I like to have
[33:13] things kind of like schedule because I
[33:15] like to see things as a time as a block
[33:17] you know so I know I wake up and from
[33:20] 708 I know there's the gym from like
[33:21] nine to like 5 p.m we're actually doing
[33:24] work
[33:25] um so my time management kind of goes
[33:27] along with that so I'm able to just
[33:29] basically say cool from 708 I have this
[33:31] block that I'm doing something for nine
[33:33] to five I'm doing something and what I
[33:35] try to do is always be on time to those
[33:37] particular times you know so and and
[33:40] it's once I'm into that mode it's it's
[33:42] that moat nothing else so if I'm at the
[33:45] gym it it's the gym there's nothing else
[33:47] if I'm at work it's work and that's what
[33:49] I do and then once I'm off work as I'm
[33:51] off work and then I'm like kind of like
[33:53] into this like Leisure mode of just like
[33:55] watching TV reading catching Out video
[33:58] games all of that so do you use a
[34:02] like to-do list app or task manager app
[34:05] I tried to I used to do a a to-do list
[34:08] but given the nature of work being so
[34:11] Dynamic uh you know sometimes those
[34:13] to-do list became like hey they're
[34:15] double the size and then next you know
[34:17] they're all done but then nothing for a
[34:19] couple times days and I will forget that
[34:22] I had the application to actually keep
[34:23] track of that so it became even for your
[34:26] personal tasks yeah even for my personal
[34:28] tax it would be just one of those things
[34:30] that is like hey I have this list of
[34:31] things that I want to do and then I will
[34:32] completely forget that I have okay and
[34:34] then just do something completely
[34:35] different so do you write on a paper
[34:37] then yes I have a notebook next to like
[34:40] in my desk everything everything okay um
[34:43] correct I I try to write everything
[34:46] mainly because like once again the
[34:48] nature of work is so Dynamic that I
[34:50] could be just writing information down
[34:52] and then we switched topics
[34:54] because I'm on another meeting you know
[34:55] like a meeting today at 4 30 and we're
[34:57] talking about how what colors are we
[34:58] gonna use for this but then the next
[35:00] meeting is related what messages are we
[35:01] gonna send so I might forget what colors
[35:04] we were talking about
[35:06] so in favor of the new meeting now so I
[35:09] will try to write down that information
[35:10] so to make sure that I can keep track of
[35:13] everything so basically what you're
[35:14] saying and interesting this is exact
[35:17] same topic that I posted today
[35:20] um like how much note-taking is
[35:22] important for a welcome to honor I mean
[35:25] a lot and most of the time in in most of
[35:28] the tickets that I cannot work on they
[35:29] start as conversations with someone else
[35:31] you know they're like hey this is not
[35:32] working you know but it's like okay
[35:34] what's not working about it uh is it
[35:36] anything in particular that's not
[35:37] working about it is it the whole thing
[35:39] so once they start describing these
[35:41] things you kind of have to write them
[35:43] down because you're eventually going to
[35:45] use that as your troubleshooting guide
[35:46] yeah you know and and it's kind of like
[35:49] the same thing if you're in a meeting
[35:50] you're trying to try to discuss
[35:51] something like you want to make sure
[35:53] that the ideas are being sure you
[35:55] remember them you know so next time
[35:57] you're having that conversation you can
[35:59] go back to them so for me especially
[36:01] note-taking is like super important I
[36:03] have I think like in the past three
[36:05] years of program so I
[36:12] you know being meetings are just you
[36:14] know deciding things that we're talking
[36:16] about how are we gonna design a table
[36:17] for a database and it's five pages of
[36:19] just like information conversations that
[36:21] I have with someone who's just like hey
[36:22] we need to add this or hey how do you
[36:24] think this logic should go
[36:26] how do we need to structure it and and
[36:28] imagine and now we're meeting where
[36:31] you're just kind of like grabbing those
[36:32] ideas writing them down yeah
[36:34] because eventually they're gonna help
[36:36] you kind of do the work that you're
[36:37] doing and and once again given the
[36:40] nature of work where we could be talking
[36:42] about one topic over here and then
[36:43] switch not having those notes could
[36:46] literally hinder your work because then
[36:48] that means that you have to meet with
[36:50] them again spend another time asking the
[36:52] same questions that you've asked before
[36:55] so you don't you like notebook compared
[36:59] to any app like OneNote yes whatever and
[37:04] the reason being is is like I I've been
[37:07] using one note on on teams but the
[37:10] problem with that is that there's so
[37:11] many clicks to actually get there to
[37:13] actually write something
[37:14] yes you know and you feel limited like
[37:17] in Notebook you can draw you can correct
[37:19] so exactly and I can do the designs and
[37:21] things like that so basically I just
[37:23] kind of went back to like pen and paper
[37:25] um mainly just for you know it's right
[37:28] here it's ready to go I don't have to
[37:30] open anything or wait for it and I just
[37:32] like write it down keep talking right
[37:34] down or keep them working so it helps a
[37:36] lot the only thing is if you have to
[37:38] find discussion from two weeks ago you
[37:41] have to go it's all right yeah you have
[37:43] to pay I mean I even put dates and and
[37:46] still makes it difficult because like
[37:48] you start going like oh look I have
[37:49] three meetings today which one is it so
[37:52] a little bit difficult but eventually
[37:54] like just make organize your notes
[37:55] that's all I can say yeah this is I I I
[38:00] think this is
[38:02] the note-taking to me is sometime even
[38:06] more important than the task management
[38:07] yeah it's how you take notes how you
[38:10] remember them how you convert is
[38:13] specifically the follow-up item like you
[38:16] you have a born hour conversation and
[38:18] after that nothing happened yeah and in
[38:21] this meeting you talk about you do the
[38:23] thing I'm on the five thing and nothing
[38:25] happened exactly back up so yeah
[38:27] definitely note taking it's it's
[38:30] definitely something you're gonna use on
[38:32] a daily yeah yeah because I mean to move
[38:35] things forward you have to keep up uh
[38:38] with the constant changes of the day yep
[38:42] so um
[38:44] how do you set your goals
[38:48] that's that's another one that's
[38:50] difficult and I don't want to say like I
[38:52] don't know how to set a goal or anything
[38:54] but it's just it's really the planning
[38:56] of the goal that sometimes is a little
[38:57] bit difficult because there's there's
[38:58] time management that needs to be
[38:59] included into that you know so for
[39:01] example like right now like I really
[39:03] want to get good at doing C sharp you
[39:06] know that way we can move things along
[39:07] and and my goal is to hey let's let's
[39:09] get it to a point where I can just write
[39:11] this without having to read
[39:12] documentation constantly you know but
[39:16] the time management of that is okay I
[39:18] need to take time to actually read the
[39:19] documentation to learn these things and
[39:22] then on top of that comes like you know
[39:24] different things like production issues
[39:25] questions some other stuff that could be
[39:27] happening testing
[39:29] um so when I set my goal I try to be
[39:32] really hard on like you're gonna get
[39:34] these two hours and it's just for this
[39:36] um because I have to be ambitious if I'm
[39:38] not ambitious about that particular goal
[39:39] that all those those other things are
[39:41] just gonna eat it away and it's going to
[39:43] prolong it you know what I mean so let's
[39:45] say my goal is going to be in three
[39:46] weeks I'm gonna be really good at this
[39:49] and if I don't pay attention to that
[39:51] it's not going to be three weeks for
[39:52] gonna be three months because the time
[39:54] management I didn't pay attention to the
[39:57] time management so I didn't actually did
[39:58] the two hours so now you have two hours
[40:00] and it becomes a snowball effect so
[40:03] whenever I'm setting my goals on my head
[40:04] I am aiming for this but what do I need
[40:07] to do to make sure that I can achieve
[40:09] this you know so I try to kind of set
[40:11] that you know I don't want to pave the
[40:13] road but at least put some you know
[40:14] Stepping Stones to make it easier to
[40:17] actually get there
[40:19] and
[40:21] what kind of goals do you have at this
[40:23] moment right now be very efficient with
[40:27] um C sharp uh definitely get more more
[40:30] fluent with French uh because my Niche
[40:32] talks like there's no tomorrow and
[40:34] doesn't understand her uh and and just
[40:38] kind of participate more in these
[40:39] conversations I would have with some of
[40:40] the seniors about like the nearest
[40:41] Technologies and and that's just for me
[40:44] to absorb so my goal in that is is to
[40:47] absorb that information not really to
[40:48] put my voice out there but just be part
[40:50] so I can learn from it you know because
[40:54] how about one year three year five year
[40:57] ten years that goals uh definitely at
[41:00] that point we're looking about uh senior
[41:01] or Lee uh and right now I'm in the
[41:06] process just kind of getting those goals
[41:07] for like senior
[41:09] um you know the way like once I get to
[41:11] like a senior level it's like hey
[41:13] like basically what like I'm doing right
[41:15] now like I'm an intermediate but like
[41:16] I've been working up those steps till
[41:18] we're seniors so by the time that I get
[41:20] to seniors like hey I already know how
[41:22] to do some of those steps now I can
[41:23] focus on how to do lead
[41:25] and then you can slowly go that so
[41:27] hopefully for maybe
[41:29] next two three years senior lead
[41:32] um that's definitely a manual
[41:34] so
[41:35] I actually created a course email course
[41:38] on just this but I wanted to ask you in
[41:43] your
[41:44] a method
[41:46] how are you identifying that what are
[41:48] the 10 things that you need to do to
[41:50] become a senior
[41:51] other than opportunity of course yeah no
[41:53] I mean unfortunately it's like number
[41:55] one but it's observing uh like the word
[41:58] that the seniors are doing you know
[42:00] um so for example like I see meet the
[42:02] meat is having a lot of discussions so
[42:04] if you know um hey if we're going to be
[42:06] given this type of response from our
[42:08] server what does that mean to the
[42:10] application I could just basically say
[42:12] hey it's okay you know but sometimes
[42:15] it's like I don't want to tell you that
[42:16] it's okay when there's items missing or
[42:18] things are not working properly and
[42:20] you're still getting something but it's
[42:22] just not complete so understanding that
[42:25] kind of like getting like oh okay so
[42:28] it's beyond this and why is the reason
[42:31] and how can we pass that information to
[42:33] the apps so instead of just saying hey I
[42:36] got a good response but it's like
[42:37] missing items I can clearly tell them
[42:39] hey it's going to be this type of
[42:41] response because you're missing items so
[42:44] basically observing the peers seniors
[42:47] leaders and trying to find what the Gap
[42:51] is what they do correct you can start
[42:53] learning yeah because I mean you start
[42:55] doing one of the things that I also kind
[42:56] of like I learned is that uh these
[42:59] different like Junior intermediate and
[43:01] Senior are per company so the structures
[43:04] are definitely you know what I mean so
[43:05] maybe the word that I'm doing as an
[43:08] intermediate right now could be
[43:09] considered junior or somewhere else you
[43:11] know or it could be considered seriously
[43:13] exactly yeah so it's it's one of those
[43:16] things that like you just gotta look at
[43:17] what the company is doing and what the
[43:19] company recognizes at that particular
[43:21] level and and learn from that you know
[43:24] so yeah as you said you know kind of
[43:26] like tagging along to those
[43:28] conversations seeing the work that
[43:30] they're doing you know kind of on and
[43:32] understanding and asking those questions
[43:33] is like what was this done this you know
[43:36] rather than okay I'll take it so just
[43:38] asking those questions
[43:40] okay
[43:41] last question check on this one is what
[43:45] is the 2 am problem the career related
[43:49] problem that you face like do you have a
[43:52] a problem that keep you awake in the
[43:55] night
[43:56] uh yeah and it's
[44:00] you know it's it's kind of like a soft
[44:03] check you know because like it's been
[44:05] what three years almost four years
[44:07] you're just constantly writing code you
[44:09] know but every time every single time
[44:12] it's just kind of like
[44:14] wave right is that right you think he's
[44:16] gonna be right it's not gonna break
[44:18] anything tomorrow right you sure so
[44:20] sometimes is is that a little bit of
[44:22] self-doubt after like someone
[44:23] something's complete you know and and
[44:26] honestly sometimes this is what keeps me
[44:28] up at night because it's like that
[44:31] I didn't know that right
[44:33] and I wake up the next morning and I go
[44:35] like
[44:36] that wasn't mean okay so it's but yeah
[44:39] it's it's little things like that that
[44:40] per communication of like I probably
[44:42] broke into something or I have damaged
[44:44] something and like now I gotta like wake
[44:47] up early and do this
[44:49] um but it only happens like during
[44:51] deployments and stuff like that for the
[44:53] next day hey this is not working I'm
[44:54] like what happened what did I do and
[44:57] it's like oh okay I gotta just press
[44:59] this okay like last week yeah supposedly
[45:02] Thursday we was off until 2 A.M yeah we
[45:06] start at 9 00 p.m and and was up until
[45:09] 2am
[45:13] full transparency here I was I passed
[45:17] out like at one I was still in the car
[45:19] and I'm just kind of like yeah yeah I
[45:21] close my eyes and I open them up and
[45:23] it's like 145 and I'm like the only one
[45:25] on the call I'm like oh my God where
[45:28] everybody goes
[45:30] foreign
[45:32] [Laughter]
[45:37] problem my 2 A.M problem because like I
[45:40] literally went to bed at 2AM but like I
[45:42] don't know if this worked or not I don't
[45:44] know what was real bad what was the
[45:45] problem did we do something I have to
[45:47] like and then the next morning I'm
[45:49] literally reading all chats and
[45:51] everything I'm like oh my God oh my God
[45:52] oh my God I took a child I remember that
[45:55] day I did so I didn't release email you
[45:58] did but that's that's what I'm saying
[45:59] like everybody executed leader so I
[46:02] didn't add all the information like then
[46:04] you send it again for everybody else and
[46:06] and and and because you basically hey we
[46:08] have to roll back and everything yeah
[46:10] and I read that I was like okay so
[46:12] things were set up correctly we left
[46:14] things good last night like there was
[46:16] nothing crazy because my first thought
[46:17] was like Hey something broke last night
[46:19] I missed it and now we're gonna be here
[46:21] at like nine in the morning working on
[46:22] this because I don't know what we're
[46:24] working on so when I saw your message
[46:26] I'm like hey we couldn't proceed we just
[46:28] rolled it back and left the how it was
[46:30] so then I was like
[46:32] all right good now we can start cycling
[46:34] this problems that we have
[46:36] um but yeah that was a good scare
[46:39] yeah and the team is there and we're
[46:41] together decided like throw it back yeah
[46:44] but I mean the good thing is that the
[46:46] next day we're able to kind of tackle
[46:48] the yeah yeah but
[46:52] cool what is your message to the
[46:56] audience the web developer Juniors I
[47:00] mean one advice that I can always give
[47:03] you is is this is gonna sound so cliche
[47:06] but there's never any stupid questions I
[47:08] mean honestly the stupid question is the
[47:10] one that is not asked because if you
[47:12] feel like you're stuck in something or
[47:13] you're trying to learn something go
[47:15] ahead and ask the question most of the
[47:17] time that person that you're asking it
[47:18] to or more than welcome to actually
[47:20] spend those 15-20 minutes kind of
[47:22] explaining it to you or showing you
[47:24] something and and I mean for me it's
[47:27] like if you're gonna spend the 20
[47:28] minutes I'm gonna listen and I'm gonna
[47:29] learn something about this that can then
[47:31] help me move along so uh and always
[47:35] practice watch videos read documentation
[47:38] lead code is is a great place for like
[47:41] code problems
[47:43] udemy if you're just trying to like get
[47:45] into learning things of what development
[47:47] and you know apis are backhand side
[47:51] um look into all of the things sometimes
[47:53] like most of this information it's free
[47:55] on the internet but like if you're just
[47:57] trying to get an idea if this is
[47:58] something that you're gonna like start
[48:00] with the free stuff you know YouTube has
[48:02] free videos look at it if you go like
[48:04] this is really something that I enjoy
[48:05] doing go for it also Ides aka the
[48:09] applications that you use to make the
[48:10] webs and things like that most of the
[48:12] time they're free so you can you can
[48:15] practice at home for free to see if you
[48:17] like it
[48:18] instead of kind of saying hey I'm just
[48:19] gonna throw money at this and be like I
[48:21] never liked
[48:22] so definitely just use the free tools
[48:25] learn if this is something that you
[48:27] really really enjoy then go ahead and
[48:29] make the investment into that career
[48:31] so it's so as a follow-up I would ask
[48:35] more direct question on this one that if
[48:37] somebody just started like three months
[48:40] ago and liking
[48:43] what would be your advice to learn and
[48:47] get a job
[48:51] as it learned as in languages yeah yeah
[48:54] I mean getting it getting into Tech like
[48:56] getting into back end maybe so we're
[48:58] gonna get into the back end right now
[49:00] definitely be Java
[49:02] um C sharp and some python
[49:06] um
[49:07] JavaScript and react native uh because
[49:10] everyone's going to move into react
[49:12] native for eastonism used for app mobile
[49:14] and things like that so JavaScript
[49:17] definitely JavaScript uh react if
[49:19] possible and you can start with like
[49:22] simple things or just like learning like
[49:24] Ms SQL if you want or like mongodb
[49:27] mongodbs and other like fairly simple um
[49:30] you know database application that you
[49:33] can use
[49:34] um but if you if you're basically trying
[49:36] to say hey I want to kind of do all
[49:38] three things you can basically just do
[49:41] node react and mongodb and just kind of
[49:43] create a tiny area yeah
[49:45] um
[49:46] that you can use to just like practice
[49:48] and stuff like that yeah and then and
[49:51] from they know I mean like once you
[49:52] create like if you're able to understand
[49:53] those three things and kind of create
[49:55] your own little app it just that turns
[49:57] into your portfolio to actually show
[49:59] someone else like it's kind of crazy
[50:01] because you know as a graphic designer
[50:03] the first thing in the interviews is I
[50:04] kind of see your portfolio and what I
[50:06] see now from people that tell me that
[50:08] they're going to interviews can they
[50:09] look at your GitHub yeah and it's like
[50:12] looking at projects that someone has
[50:14] worked on being describing so it's it's
[50:15] becoming this thing so if you're able to
[50:17] slowly start creating little projects if
[50:19] you don't have to be big you can just
[50:20] create one app that does one thing
[50:22] that's it and then build another one
[50:24] that does a completely different thing
[50:26] and if you feel like you know
[50:27] challenging enough just try to mix them
[50:29] both but you know build your own little
[50:32] thing where you can just say hey here's
[50:33] my here's my work this is what I've done
[50:36] yeah and and sometimes your work speaks
[50:38] more than you or your resume
[50:41] um and and that can definitely help you
[50:43] out
[50:45] and then if somebody's like just started
[50:47] got a job
[50:49] just got a job and now trying to figure
[50:51] out how I'm gonna kind of move into this
[50:55] career next three five years what would
[50:58] be your advice to that person uh
[51:01] kind of like tag along someone that's a
[51:03] little bit higher than you and ask those
[51:05] questions like another question about
[51:07] how do you do this but more of kind of
[51:09] like why was that decision taken you
[51:12] know perfect because you're trying to
[51:14] understand like if I tell hey we're
[51:15] gonna use red all right we'll use red
[51:17] but the question should be like why did
[51:19] we pick Ram is there anything in
[51:20] particular why we're using bread
[51:23] that explanation will open up more in in
[51:26] your head of like oh okay now I can see
[51:28] why this is affecting this color will
[51:30] affect this and how will affect it in
[51:33] the future for other things but if you
[51:35] just say like okay red
[51:37] that's that's where it stops that's
[51:38] where the learning stops because you're
[51:40] like okay I'm done yeah but it should be
[51:42] like why is it red and hot why we're
[51:44] implementing it this way right and then
[51:46] and it's not really a question to
[51:48] challenge the other person but it's more
[51:50] to kind of like open those doors of
[51:51] communication say tell me more about
[51:53] this I'm interested tell me more I want
[51:56] to learn it and 90 of the time most of
[51:58] the time when I've done it people are
[51:59] like grab a chair man let's go and yeah
[52:02] 15-20 minutes they're open to to
[52:04] actually tell you when you write yeah
[52:05] ask the right questions correct yeah and
[52:07] even if it's the wrong question because
[52:09] they're like hey I'm trying to do this
[52:11] and they're like it's not done this way
[52:12] but let me show you or you can just say
[52:14] hey can you show me how to do this and
[52:15] and like I said most people will be just
[52:18] kind of very happy yeah to show you like
[52:20] these why questions yeah just
[52:24] awesome
[52:25] well Carlos thank you so much thank you
[52:28] for
[52:28] um
[52:30] is there any question that I have not
[52:33] asked but you want to answer
[52:35] uh
[52:39] yes and and this probably hasn't been
[52:43] touched I don't know if you actually I
[52:44] had asked it to anyone but and and this
[52:47] is a question that like I asked myself
[52:49] and and I started late asking it like
[52:51] fairly late
[52:52] um but it's like how stressful do you
[52:55] see your job
[52:56] you know because people can just
[52:58] basically say oh my I do all of this I
[53:01] was like I understand but like how
[53:02] stressful do you see your job you know
[53:05] and and it really just comes down to
[53:07] like the perspective that you are
[53:09] observing of how your job is right at
[53:10] the moment you know so when I started as
[53:12] a junior I was like how's your words
[53:14] like oh my God it's extremely chaotic
[53:16] like it's just there's so many things
[53:17] going on at once yeah but then again it
[53:20] was just me kind of like just getting an
[53:22] idea you know of like what this is and
[53:24] it was very stressful because it was
[53:26] just I it was it was like I was almost
[53:27] shelter right like I didn't know what
[53:29] the other apps were or what they did or
[53:31] how they integrated I was only like
[53:33] support tool and maybe some changes here
[53:35] to the API so it's very close
[53:37] um but like as you open you know like
[53:40] that stress of like I'm like oh it
[53:42] starts to go away you know so at the
[53:44] beginning for me it was it was very
[53:45] stressful mainly because I just I was
[53:47] just not aware of what was going on and
[53:50] that stressed me out because it was like
[53:51] I'm I
[53:52] wasn't me you know it wasn't me but as
[53:56] as time progressed you know that stress
[53:58] became less and less because I was more
[54:00] aware of what was happening I was
[54:01] understanding what was happening I was
[54:03] asking those questions so people were
[54:04] like hey this is what's going on
[54:07] um
[54:07] so going into that like at the beginning
[54:09] yes was the stressful 100 but it was
[54:12] basically because I was not comfortable
[54:13] like in the role yet once instead of
[54:16] getting more comfortable that stress
[54:18] slowly started going away
[54:20] but it's it's all about just kind of
[54:22] like feeling confident and it is also
[54:24] feeling like relaxed in the role that
[54:27] you're doing like if you don't if you're
[54:29] not confident in the role that you're
[54:30] doing if you don't feel like you're not
[54:33] comfortable there's going to be a lot of
[54:35] stress coming in you know people said
[54:37] hey the stress comes from like the work
[54:38] it's like you know every day like life
[54:41] throws things at you but you know it's
[54:43] really how you react to them that really
[54:45] detects like your attitude so if if you
[54:48] throw something at me and I just kind of
[54:50] like get angry I gain nothing from that
[54:53] you know but if you throw something at
[54:54] me I'm kind of like oh whoa what's going
[54:56] on you know it it starts to go beyond
[54:59] that
[54:59] [Music]
[55:01] that was really deep inside thank you
[55:05] thank you for answering that cushion
[55:06] sure that's really deep
[55:09] do you have a question for me
[55:11] yes uh how did you get to the point of
[55:15] actually doing this like what was
[55:17] something that like inside of you that
[55:19] just said hey this is the spark that I
[55:21] have kind of like what was it that you
[55:23] because I know what you do at work you
[55:26] know and and it's a 180 from this yeah
[55:29] you know uh so what was this spark what
[55:31] was the the one thing that you said like
[55:33] this is something that I want to pursue
[55:35] and what did you do to actually get here
[55:39] and you talking about this podcast or in
[55:41] general I'm talking about the podcast
[55:42] because I mean like you know you cannot
[55:45] talk about like Advent hell like you
[55:46] became like a manager and everything but
[55:48] this is a side that we have never talked
[55:50] about we have to talk about things about
[55:51] work but like this is very interesting
[55:53] for me like uh even since we had like
[55:55] the first conversation that we had
[55:57] um I was like I'm interested in knowing
[55:59] like what got you here because
[56:01] like is it this this setup is not
[56:03] amateur you know it's it's like you guys
[56:07] are not seeing this but there's tons of
[56:09] things around here
[56:10] um but it's it's like yes you know like
[56:13] this actually shows some passion behind
[56:15] it and that some time and like
[56:17] definitive like thought process behind
[56:20] it so what spark that and what led you
[56:24] to what we're seeing here
[56:27] great so
[56:33] I will give you a slightly longer answer
[56:35] okay
[56:36] um when I was in high school I got into
[56:39] a essay competition and magically I won
[56:43] it like gold medal okay and then
[56:48] um when geocity or some
[56:52] blogger website open I started writing
[56:56] how writing was a ingrained part of me
[57:01] like I take notes I do a lot of things
[57:04] right writing is where I get most of my
[57:07] clarity and organizations
[57:09] so when I when I finish writing I feel
[57:12] like I'm calm like everything is inside
[57:15] is not exactly yeah right so writing was
[57:18] something
[57:19] and
[57:21] so it was all hazy I mean
[57:27] um zigzag like it's not organized in
[57:30] terms of when I was I I would start
[57:32] writing a Blog and then I would stop it
[57:34] and my English was not good so I was
[57:37] hesitant to publish it or I would stop
[57:40] doing it
[57:41] um so that has happened in 2006 9 11 16
[57:48] so I've started like four different
[57:50] times but you never stopped I never
[57:52] stopped right I keep going back to it so
[57:55] then around 2019 I started writing on
[57:58] medium my one of my articles I just
[58:02] checked it yesterday on like 200 sorry
[58:05] 530 like it's it's got traction right it
[58:10] gets traction
[58:12] so when I started in 2019 Cassie helped
[58:15] me proof reading my articles okay and
[58:18] that gave me tremendous confidence and
[58:20] then she also shown me how I can kind of
[58:23] correct my mistakes and how I can use
[58:26] grammarly
[58:28] so that went on for four years until
[58:31] last year
[58:33] where I was posting different thing that
[58:36] I'm learning different thing that I am
[58:38] doing like when I transform my old team
[58:42] from a waterfall to a agile I write
[58:46] about it like what are the challenges
[58:48] how the journey looked like how my
[58:50] transformation happened
[58:52] so I was just writing about different
[58:54] things and last four years I also felt
[58:57] like I was stuck at some point where my
[59:00] next aspiration was not clear I could
[59:04] continue with the path where Junior to
[59:06] senior to team leader to manager and
[59:07] Senior manager next one would have been
[59:10] director
[59:11] so I got into this Executive coaching
[59:14] the plan for that coaching was to
[59:17] prepare me for next position
[59:20] during that coaching I realized
[59:23] that the thing that I'm going back to
[59:26] like writing and creation and teaching
[59:29] that's something that element that I
[59:32] should Explore More
[59:33] that was your spark that was like yeah
[59:35] right I need this yeah I I need some
[59:39] calling so from there
[59:42] last year I joined a program membership
[59:44] 3430 and that's when everything changed
[59:48] um I had started my
[59:52] um
[59:53] podcast before that actually okay when
[59:57] um there was somebody named
[1:00:00] um
[1:00:02] Kristen she was uh some one of the
[1:00:06] director she was in Process Management
[1:00:09] uh Christine she was in Process
[1:00:12] Management at all and she was retiring
[1:00:14] the day she was retiring or the week she
[1:00:17] was retiring and said I'm gonna record
[1:00:19] and I asked her
[1:00:21] um can I interview you you have
[1:00:23] tremendous career journey and I'd like
[1:00:27] to interview you ask questions that how
[1:00:30] did you start and how did you reach so
[1:00:31] that was my first interview and after
[1:00:33] that I was like I love it I love knowing
[1:00:36] about people so this is perfect so I
[1:00:39] started interviewing a lot of people and
[1:00:41] I set a goal I found that 90 of the
[1:00:44] people drop off before the 10 episode
[1:00:47] interesting and 97 people drop off in
[1:00:52] their podcast before 21 episode so I
[1:00:57] gave myself a goal of 10 and then 21.
[1:00:59] and now I'm like 38 37 wow yeah so
[1:01:05] yeah so
[1:01:07] it went like this
[1:01:10] um and I just wanted to be consistent
[1:01:14] like if I start something I just want to
[1:01:16] keep it
[1:01:18] um and now I'm more on the writing side
[1:01:21] more on the the
[1:01:24] product creation side and everything all
[1:01:28] my hobbies and everything is narrowing
[1:01:30] down to how can I help that one person
[1:01:33] do better in their job like goal setting
[1:01:37] productivity and time management
[1:01:40] and because the entire career that I had
[1:01:44] was web developers yeah that's the first
[1:01:47] set of people that I will help
[1:01:50] um and another thing that I said for
[1:01:54] myself is not to go after the shiny
[1:01:56] object that I always go so I decided I
[1:01:59] will use my phone until I'm done with 20
[1:02:03] episode or 21 episode I will not buy a
[1:02:06] fancy camera or this and that because
[1:02:09] those things can hold you yeah if you
[1:02:12] just focus on tools and also I'm still
[1:02:15] using phone I mean Technologies nowadays
[1:02:18] or it's so Advanced to the point that
[1:02:20] you can get really high quality at a
[1:02:22] fair price without actually having to
[1:02:24] you know invest in like really expensive
[1:02:25] stuff so that's how it started and
[1:02:27] that's where it's going
[1:02:29] um it's almost like I'm
[1:02:31] I can do this because
[1:02:34] it it comes from inside like I don't
[1:02:37] have to push myself to wake up at four
[1:02:40] o'clock so every day 4 30 to 7 30 I just
[1:02:43] do this and I don't know how to force
[1:02:45] myself to wake up or I mean no like you
[1:02:48] can tell that that is that is Passion
[1:02:49] because yeah let's be honest who the
[1:02:51] hell is going to wake up before then go
[1:02:53] like no I'm gonna do this no one no one
[1:02:55] like you know unless there's passion
[1:02:56] behind it where you're like you're
[1:02:57] waking up and going like this is no
[1:02:59] bother to me yeah yeah so you can
[1:03:01] clearly show and tell that you have
[1:03:03] dispatch with me I mean look at your
[1:03:05] setup man well thank you so much Carlos
[1:03:07] thank you for having me man for this
[1:03:08] interview I think this interview will be
[1:03:11] useful for many people who want to
[1:03:13] really honestly to the same Journey that
[1:03:16] you have done your full strap
[1:03:18] thank you no thank you appreciate it
[1:03:21] [Music]