Scrum Master Insights: A Day in the Life of Ferran at AdventHealth (Ep 31)

[0:01] Thank you, Fen, for accepting my request
[0:03] for this interview.
[0:05] Yeah, I was really excited to be
[0:07] offered.
[0:08] So, let's start with um um
[0:11] who you are, what you do.
[0:14] So, currently I am working at Advent
[0:17] Health as a scrum master within their
[0:19] digital group.
[0:20] And uh as a scrum master,
[0:23] what's your day in life?
[0:26] It varies. Every day is a new day. Um,
[0:30] I'll say on a great simple day, on a
[0:34] great simple day, wake up before daily
[0:37] standup. I look at the board, look at
[0:40] notes from the previous day. From there,
[0:43] I write down what I need to talk to the
[0:44] team about to get ready for daily
[0:47] standup, whether it be their blockers or
[0:48] their notes from the previous day. Go
[0:50] into morning meetings. From morning
[0:52] meetings, talk to them face to face
[0:55] virtually. What happened? And then it's
[0:58] a 15-minute meeting. So then it turns
[1:00] into takeaways. So one-on-one
[1:02] conversation, what we talked about at
[1:04] daily standup, that could be another 15
[1:07] to 30 minutes depending on how many
[1:09] people had information. Then from there,
[1:12] I go back to myself and work on the
[1:14] board again because if someone didn't
[1:16] update the board or adding additional
[1:18] comments or questions, concerns or
[1:20] calling out dependencies and just
[1:22] double-checking what people said they
[1:23] said or looking for people having
[1:27] blockers coming their way and they may
[1:29] not have identified it themsel yet
[1:32] within themselves or at daily standup.
[1:34] Oh, I'm seeing hey, it's mid-sprint. You
[1:37] haven't touched this work. you may not
[1:39] be able to complete it to done before
[1:41] the end of the 2 weeks. So then that's
[1:44] by myself and then by that point it's
[1:46] usually lunchtime if not organic
[1:49] spontaneous meetings have interrupted
[1:51] that which makes it take longer and then
[1:53] I'm like okay lunchtime sometimes
[1:55] there's meeting during sometimes there's
[1:56] not then afternoon comeback guns blazing
[2:00] there's usually at least one agile
[2:02] ceremony if not a po planned meeting so
[2:06] from morning standup we weren't able to
[2:08] talk one-on-one so we need a group
[2:10] meeting more collaborative you know
[2:12] three to five people from of the team to
[2:14] make decisive answers to their questions
[2:17] at daily standup. So a structured
[2:19] meeting like that. So two possible
[2:21] options. If neither of those happen on a
[2:23] normal day, then I'm usually talking to
[2:26] the PO on road mapping needs from them
[2:30] things that I'm seeing from a scrum
[2:31] master perspective. And if that isn't
[2:34] even happening, then I'm road mapping
[2:36] myself as execution. So then I can talk
[2:38] to someone above me to say, "No one is
[2:42] seeing this, but I am seeing this and I
[2:44] need to tell somebody." So then that
[2:46] will take me into the afternoon to then
[2:48] I'm ready to close my laptop and I'm
[2:50] writing my final notes before I can do
[2:52] it all over another day. That is my day
[2:56] on a good day. Simple day. Yes.
[2:58] And then you have some special days
[3:02] where you have a special activities like
[3:04] sprint clothes or
[3:05] Yes. So on those days again in my office
[3:10] will be like sprint closing days where
[3:12] you have more ceremonies like your
[3:14] sprint review, your retrospective that
[3:16] would normally interrupt the times that
[3:18] I'm working on the board or doing those
[3:20] one-on-one check-in points. So those
[3:22] days are a little bit more full of
[3:25] ceremonies and then
[3:28] it's just full of ceremonies
[3:31] which is another word in the agile world
[3:33] for meetings to show cadence and
[3:35] predictability that structure
[3:38] and um if I try to give a very high
[3:41] level idea then
[3:44] every day you have a
[3:47] what do we call it stand up or daily
[3:49] daily stand I mean it depends on where
[3:51] you work some People call it a daily
[3:52] standup, an iteration standup. Um, some
[3:56] people site DSU for short. So, it
[3:59] depends on where you're working and what
[4:01] is the common words that that office
[4:03] use. But nothing is wrong. It's just
[4:05] what does that office call it.
[4:07] So, every day in the morning, that's the
[4:09] place where you product owner,
[4:14] all the programmers come together.
[4:16] Yes. As a team, whoever is identified as
[4:19] part of that team. So the people you
[4:21] mentioned plus possibly QA will come to
[4:24] say this is what I'm working on today.
[4:27] This is where I can be collaborative
[4:29] with someone else. This is where I'm
[4:31] asking for collaboration. That is a come
[4:34] together moment where we can sync, ask
[4:37] for help and communicate blockers so
[4:39] everyone can know what's going on within
[4:41] your team.
[4:43] Cool. I will ask one more question again
[4:46] to give an idea to anybody who is
[4:49] listening.
[4:51] Um
[4:52] at least in adv
[4:56] sprints.
[4:57] Mhm.
[4:58] So the process of identifying the work
[5:01] for that two week.
[5:02] Mhm.
[5:03] Um
[5:05] how that happened?
[5:07] How do we identify what can be completed
[5:09] within two weeks?
[5:10] Right? How do team plan that this is
[5:12] what they will do for two weeks?
[5:14] So it's a long process. So any scrum
[5:16] master will talk about like the
[5:18] storming, forming, norming and then
[5:20] performing stages of team development.
[5:22] So within being able to plan your
[5:25] commits, commit and complete it within
[5:27] that twoe iteration is a growing
[5:30] process. It will start at sprint
[5:32] planning. Granted, some people say it
[5:34] doesn't start at sprint planning. Fair,
[5:36] it starts at backlog refinement. So it
[5:38] depends on who you're talking to when
[5:40] when does that conversation or plan on
[5:43] your commitment start? But I like to say
[5:45] it formally starts at planning where you
[5:49] are saying I can finish. I will commit
[5:52] to this for the next two weeks. And
[5:54] backlog refinement is more theory. We're
[5:57] still refining. So it just depends on
[5:59] who you're talking to.
[6:00] Yeah. For those people it's the concept
[6:03] of sprint zero, right? Yes.
[6:05] That's where you start where you don't
[6:07] have any backlog. You come there sprint
[6:10] zero and then you figure out everything.
[6:12] Yes. So,
[6:13] and you also can identify like what is
[6:15] going to be counted. So, like we also
[6:17] have, you know, I always talk about like
[6:19] we are not pointing bugs. So, you're
[6:21] also how is that part of your
[6:23] commitment? Some teams do make that part
[6:25] of your commitment and put that into
[6:27] their capacity of what we can finish in
[6:30] two weeks. Other people are more
[6:32] numeric. So, they'll say we will not
[6:34] accept more than five bugs. Those could
[6:37] be little baby bugs that is just UI
[6:39] changes or it could be logic changes
[6:41] that have created this bug. But they
[6:43] said we're not going to commit more than
[6:45] the number five of bugs. So it just
[6:47] depends. So I don't remember why we
[6:51] started estimating bugs and task but
[6:56] now we are not and I do not
[6:58] you do not and uh we just had a
[7:00] conversation Iet and I so she also
[7:03] stopped and today I had a conversation
[7:06] with Aaron
[7:07] okay
[7:08] and throughout digital group we will not
[7:10] estimate task bugs
[7:13] okay
[7:14] moving forward
[7:15] okay
[7:16] in
[7:18] It depends on what is the collaborative
[7:20] agreement. I do find value that there's
[7:23] a consistent agreement because what we
[7:27] find is that the teams are being judged
[7:29] by different things. So for my specific
[7:32] situation, my teams don't point bugs,
[7:36] but we have comparison that it's apples
[7:38] to apples. So then people would say to
[7:40] me, well fair as scrum master, how do
[7:43] you allow your teams to undercommit if
[7:45] they're committing only 30 points? And I
[7:48] said, what do you mean my team is not is
[7:50] under committing? They're guns blazing
[7:52] all the time. Oh, but your team is
[7:54] committing 30 points and other teams,
[7:57] which is an agile never should do.
[7:59] Comparing other teams is completing 70s
[8:02] something points. So we talk about like
[8:04] is it apples to apples? No. What is the
[8:07] difference? Why are you comparing teams?
[8:09] Are they the same people?
[8:10] Did that happen within our department?
[8:12] Yes.
[8:13] Yes.
[8:13] Interesting.
[8:14] Yes. So,
[8:15] at least they didn't come to me.
[8:16] No, they came directly on what is going
[8:19] on here and how is this justifying and
[8:22] it's just part of part of being a scrum
[8:24] master is advocating, explaining and
[8:28] showing how you can grow. So it's
[8:30] interesting and new to me that as a
[8:32] department we're deciding not to point
[8:34] bugs and task and what was the third one
[8:38] task subtask bugs
[8:40] okay
[8:41] and then we sometime call a spike
[8:44] a task
[8:44] a task right so all those
[8:47] so on my teams we do point task so
[8:49] that'll be something new for me to bring
[8:51] to the team so no more
[8:52] pointing task can I ask how did we get
[8:54] to that point
[8:56] how did we
[8:57] yeah how was it agreed or what was the
[8:59] logic behind the agreement.
[9:00] So honestly I don't remember why we
[9:02] started and I don't want to remember but
[9:05] uh one of the thing that we started
[9:07] doing in last 6 month is uh time
[9:10] tracking.
[9:11] Mhm.
[9:12] So now everybody putting their time in
[9:15] these Jira task so I have that
[9:18] additional information that I didn't
[9:21] have before. So now um with the stories
[9:25] we are estimating how much value we
[9:27] producing and then I have this in my
[9:31] back pocket if somebody need that
[9:33] additional information or if I have to
[9:35] go and check u something I have that
[9:38] that I could use it. So with task
[9:42] stories and uh bugs we have the actual
[9:45] time that somebody has taken to resolve
[9:48] it.
[9:50] So then I ask because on the team level
[9:52] I'm thinking team specific scrum
[9:55] mastermind in pointing task I always ask
[9:58] my team to refine what is the task you
[10:01] are doing even if it's a spike. So if
[10:04] the purpose is to learn about XYZ, what
[10:07] do you need the person to learn
[10:09] specifically?
[10:11] Then from there you story point. Okay
[10:14] developer I need you to learn
[10:15] specifically XYZ. Developer says to
[10:18] learn XYZ specifically I think is a
[10:21] storyoint five because of the complexity
[10:24] the time the people I need to reach out
[10:26] to. What makes me interested in this
[10:29] conversation is at the end of the day
[10:31] the developer has maybe taken for
[10:34] simplistic term a week or a day to do
[10:37] that task but that was part of their
[10:39] capacity. So now we're losing sight of
[10:42] the true capacity of that developer by
[10:45] not pointing task which in the long term
[10:49] the team may undercommit because we're
[10:51] not taking in the capacity of that task
[10:55] cuz it did take time, money, effort
[10:57] and it is value.
[11:02] Same thing applied to a spike which is
[11:04] again task.
[11:05] Yeah.
[11:06] And it could be a to-do list of type
[11:08] task.
[11:09] Mhm. So all those uh my understanding is
[11:13] some of those are really hard to
[11:14] estimate compared to a story.
[11:16] Yes.
[11:17] And um other I mean you have a very
[11:20] specific example but in most of the time
[11:23] task and spikes are not directly adding
[11:26] value indirectly probably. Um so that
[11:31] was my thought process.
[11:32] Okay.
[11:34] I have nothing to add. I just feel like
[11:36] it's tomato tomato and um I just want
[11:41] what I found was that we were not
[11:43] specifically identifying what the
[11:46] developer need to do. So we would end up
[11:49] a sprint with a spike that the developer
[11:52] said, "Yeah, I looked at this. It's
[11:54] done." And then lo and behold, the PO
[11:58] was like, "You didn't learn what I
[12:00] needed you to learn."
[12:02] And then the developer, I spent three
[12:04] days looking through the coding on their
[12:06] website
[12:06] and they didn't learn what was needed to
[12:08] be learned. So then we're doing we're
[12:11] creating another spike for them to
[12:13] specifically gain insight
[12:15] on a future feature within that item
[12:19] that they needed to learn about when it
[12:21] should have been explained what you
[12:23] needed to do.
[12:24] So stories typically have that
[12:26] acceptance criteria type thing. Do you
[12:28] think those type of thing can be done
[12:30] here? Like if you if if this is a task
[12:33] related to learning
[12:35] we do on my teams we do that is the
[12:38] acceptance criteria at the end of the
[12:40] day you need to know how to do this this
[12:42] and this example amplitude
[12:45] the acceptance criteria was the spike
[12:46] was learn of amplitude within that spike
[12:50] the acceptance criteria was understand
[12:52] what an event understand what an event
[12:54] property is understand how to create
[12:57] tags within our code for amplitude and
[13:00] how to merge it. It's all a spike. You
[13:03] never actually created an amplitude tag,
[13:05] but you now have four things that you
[13:08] learned. So the next sprint, you can
[13:10] effectively put in the amplitude tag
[13:13] versus just say learn about amplitude.
[13:15] What does that mean? What do you want me
[13:16] to learn? Learn about its stock ratings.
[13:21] So that's what we said. We asked for
[13:23] specific things
[13:25] and that's being a scrum master, right?
[13:28] Yes. Level setting. You you have a
[13:31] product owner with an expectation. You
[13:33] have engineering team, programmers with
[13:35] an expectation and you're you connecting
[13:38] the dot there.
[13:39] Yes. Level setting expectation like that
[13:42] is my all day. What do you want? What
[13:45] can you do? And how do we meet in the
[13:47] middle?
[13:48] So it's really cool. I mean I enjoy it.
[13:50] So speaking to that part
[13:51] okay
[13:52] beginning in the beginning whenever you
[13:55] start a new team or whenever you join a
[13:57] new team you go through couple of
[13:59] activities
[14:01] yes
[14:01] let's talk about that
[14:02] so in starting a new team introductions
[14:05] of course they're called like working
[14:07] agreement working sessions agile team
[14:10] kickstarters everyone calls it something
[14:12] different it's whatever you want within
[14:14] your department personalizing it um but
[14:18] everyone knows like your working
[14:19] agreement session was always my
[14:20] favorite. Get that done as soon as
[14:22] possible because your working agreement
[14:24] sets your expectation. No one wants to
[14:27] let down the team.
[14:29] No one wants to be that terrible
[14:30] teammate. So, in a working agreement
[14:33] session, you're identifying what makes a
[14:36] good teammate and what we expect of
[14:37] others on our team and what I can expect
[14:40] of myself. So, you're work how do we
[14:43] want to work together? I've been on
[14:45] teams that it's been so precise and I
[14:48] say anal for lack of a better word or
[14:51] more fun like don't do stupid be a nice
[14:54] person you know so it depends on the
[14:57] team it depends on the scrum master I I
[15:00] for lack of a better what they will
[15:01] accept as part of a working agreement
[15:04] what you know about the past team
[15:06] members the new team members for what
[15:09] you will accept and what you're going to
[15:11] guide them into wanting to make a
[15:13] conversation
[15:14] because you go into these working
[15:16] agreement sessions and people are just
[15:17] like
[15:19] they're not they don't want to be an
[15:20] active participant. So as a scrum master
[15:23] sometimes you are facilitating the
[15:25] intriguing like do we want to talk about
[15:27] this like most recently it was
[15:31] having sessions that our scrum master
[15:33] and or PO cannot attend. Do we still
[15:36] find value in it and do we still want to
[15:38] have this meeting? Some teams are like,
[15:39] "Yeah, we can backlog refine our own
[15:42] items as a developer team without the
[15:44] scrum master or PO." Other teams may
[15:46] say, "No, if my PO and scrum master, I
[15:49] don't need to be here." So, it depends
[15:51] on the people, the team, how what stage
[15:54] and team development that team is in.
[15:58] Yes. So, it depends
[15:59] and I try to oversimplify things. So a
[16:04] working agreement
[16:05] okay
[16:06] is something uh where a scrum master
[16:09] product owner and programming team comes
[16:12] yes
[16:12] with a blank slate
[16:15] and sometimes QA
[16:17] QA
[16:17] yes
[16:18] so they they go there with a blank slate
[16:21] um and then
[16:22] they start talking and within next 30
[16:26] minute everybody put their ideas of what
[16:29] agreement look like.
[16:30] Yes. One of the example that Fen was
[16:33] giving is um um should we have a backlog
[16:37] refinement if a product owner and a
[16:40] scrum master cannot attend. So team
[16:44] discuss that and that become an
[16:46] agreement that if they are not one of
[16:49] them are not there team that meeting is
[16:51] canled.
[16:52] Yes. So they go with blank slate
[16:56] everybody discuss come up with the idea
[16:58] and then by the end of that 30 minute
[17:00] meeting they have five to 10 agreement
[17:03] that everybody will follow
[17:05] minimum requirements for the team
[17:07] minimum requirement for the team and I
[17:09] love um some of
[17:13] some of the agreement that come up but
[17:16] consistently come up in each team is
[17:19] what's the definition of is is that a
[17:21] separate thing or working agreement.
[17:22] I work it as a separate.
[17:24] Okay. Okay. Then we will talk about
[17:25] that. Okay.
[17:26] Okay. Talking about working agreement
[17:28] and this is our life. We get phone call,
[17:31] we jump into the call, we finish that
[17:33] call, we come back and we continue.
[17:36] Task switching at its finest.
[17:38] Yes.
[17:40] But that's life as a scrum master,
[17:42] right?
[17:43] Yeah, it really is. you're there for
[17:45] other people and however best you can
[17:48] plan your own day um it can change
[17:51] depending upon what other people needs.
[17:54] Yes. Um someone told me what does it
[17:57] mean to you to be a scrum master and
[17:58] what I told to them is to be humble. You
[18:01] have to be very humble in being a scrum
[18:03] master in a sense that you are the
[18:05] cheerleader that no one sees. You are
[18:09] the riding champion that no one sees.
[18:11] You get none of the glory. You're a
[18:13] sidekick. Am I crazy?
[18:18] Yes. Just just checking it's working.
[18:22] Tell me more about that.
[18:24] About getting none of the glory and
[18:26] being humble as a scrum master.
[18:28] Yeah, the glory part.
[18:31] About getting none of the glory. So when
[18:32] I talk to people about wanting to be a
[18:35] scrum master, my first question to them
[18:37] is, do you need to be the head at all
[18:40] times? Because being a scrum master is
[18:42] not about being the head. You support,
[18:47] let me rephrase.
[18:49] In true agile, you and the product owner
[18:52] are counterparts. You guys are equal and
[18:54] opposites. You do totally different
[18:56] things, but you're equal and opposite.
[18:58] In a lot of organizations, the PO will
[19:02] get all of the sunshine knowing that you
[19:05] and the PO are completely opposites.
[19:08] You counteract them and they counteract
[19:10] you. You do not do the same things. So
[19:13] when I say what needs to be a good scrum
[19:15] master is someone who does not need to
[19:18] be the light. They do not need to be the
[19:20] sun but they know they add value to
[19:23] their team. That's makes a good scrum
[19:25] master that not everybody understands.
[19:29] That was powerful. Thank you
[19:31] for sharing that.
[19:36] That can also
[19:38] indicate to the people who are not in
[19:42] day-to-day
[19:43] that they don't know what a scrum master
[19:46] is doing
[19:47] because right because
[19:49] you're working in the core soul of the
[19:53] team and uh the people who are outside
[19:57] they may not see all this
[19:59] they don't see example there was a
[20:03] developer he is leveling up in his
[20:06] career. He's been doing amazing things
[20:09] as a developer. And I checked in with
[20:11] him, you know, scrum master, checking in
[20:13] on your team. And he just seemed worn,
[20:16] weathered, and burnt out. And he was
[20:19] just trying to push through it as we go
[20:21] through this big deployment and release.
[20:23] And I literally just said, "Take two
[20:25] days." Because he was so worn, so
[20:29] weathered, and he was trying to hide it.
[20:31] But you won't know that until as a scrum
[20:34] master you check in like with your
[20:36] develop like you're doing nothing wrong.
[20:37] I just want to say hey what's going on
[20:40] in your world like on that personal
[20:41] level because that translates to them
[20:45] being productive like I care about you
[20:47] as a person as a colleague but I also
[20:50] know that if you're dealing with things
[20:52] you're not being as efficient as I need
[20:54] you to be to finish our project on time.
[20:57] So, it's two-handed, but um yes, you
[21:01] definitely have to be that heartbeat.
[21:03] So, how do you recognize that type of
[21:05] situation with someone?
[21:08] Not really recognition. It's making time
[21:10] for it. Making time to check in like
[21:13] things I if I don't have time to check
[21:15] in with everyone specifically on a
[21:17] consistent basis. What I like to do at
[21:19] standup as an example most recently is
[21:22] like today tell me what is your idea of
[21:26] paradise? So I say while you're giving
[21:27] me your update of yesterday, today and
[21:29] blockers, give me a couple lines of what
[21:32] is to you a paradise and just give
[21:34] people that opportunity to verbalize
[21:36] what is their paradise. And in doing
[21:38] that, you offer that moment for that
[21:41] person to just disappear and go to that
[21:44] spot and the team to also go to that
[21:47] spot with that person. And then as a
[21:50] team, we are taking a moment to take a
[21:52] breath and we're also learning about our
[21:55] teammate, learning about what it means
[21:57] to them. In this specific case, my
[21:59] question was paradise. Like me, it's the
[22:02] bugilia plant and like being on a beach
[22:06] wearing linen and oh, I love that plant.
[22:10] Oh, I love beaches. What's your favorite
[22:12] beach? You have a moment of
[22:15] you learn about your teammate. And I'm
[22:18] also learning what I need to learn about
[22:20] yesterday, today and blockers. It's a
[22:22] connection point. You know what I mean?
[22:24] That is part of being a scrum master and
[22:26] getting that moment and forcing them to
[22:28] take to take a moment. So sometimes they
[22:32] get overwhelmed. They're like, "Ah, I
[22:33] have no idea." And and then I need to
[22:37] check in on that person if they can't
[22:38] even tell me what paradise is to them.
[22:41] And yeah, or the people that don't want
[22:44] to be an active participant. You can't
[22:46] tell me about your paradise. You're so
[22:48] checked out that I need to also check in
[22:50] on you.
[22:51] Things like that.
[22:54] Okay.
[22:56] Those type of detail is what I love to
[22:59] grab. So, initial questions where we
[23:01] answering right um after that this type
[23:04] of uh souls comes out.
[23:06] Okay.
[23:07] So,
[23:08] so you want the extras.
[23:09] Yeah. Yeah. because right
[23:12] that's um
[23:13] but I don't force it it
[23:15] no it happens organically
[23:17] organically comes right
[23:19] so now we're going to touch upon the
[23:22] definition of done because it's so
[23:24] crucial for any team
[23:27] yes
[23:27] and so I will let you speak and then my
[23:30] own experience with definition of done
[23:34] a sprint close and then we are having
[23:36] conversation okay
[23:38] did it meet the definition of done
[23:40] because a developer will tell you, "Oh,
[23:42] well, it's basically done." What does
[23:44] basically done mean?
[23:46] It work on my machine.
[23:48] That's why the definition of done. You
[23:51] need to put it into an environment that
[23:53] someone that is not you can test what
[23:55] you did. A recording is not enough to
[23:58] meet the definition of done. But let's
[24:00] backtrack.
[24:02] What is the definition of done?
[24:04] Definition of done is a standardized
[24:07] rule for the team to decide when from
[24:10] sprint planning work that was committed
[24:12] is completed. Definitely done. No
[24:17] questions about it. So as a team you'll
[24:19] have a working session to identify,
[24:21] classify, detect, whatever word you want
[24:23] to use.
[24:24] Become when you was in high school.
[24:26] A lawyer.
[24:27] Yeah, you do.
[24:28] Mhm. Yeah. Was in debate
[24:32] all throughout high school.
[24:34] love debate, prep for pre-law, applied
[24:38] for pre-law like Stson.
[24:42] I was ready to be a lawyer and I said,
[24:45] why don't I just go to school, get my AA
[24:47] in like business. And then from there,
[24:49] once I get my AA, then go over to
[24:52] pre-law. But it was while at FIU
[24:55] studying, I met some students in pre-law
[24:58] that were not pre-law, they were in law
[25:00] school. And FIU law program is top
[25:03] something. It's accredited blah blah
[25:05] trifecta.
[25:07] The law students looked dead. Red eyes,
[25:11] no life balance, everything. Then I went
[25:15] further, start talking to lawyers, like
[25:19] interacting with them, having
[25:21] interviews, not interviews, but like,
[25:22] hey, can you please tell me about your
[25:24] day in your life of being a lawyer so I
[25:25] can know if this is what's for me? It
[25:28] was not for me. The lack of work life
[25:30] balance
[25:32] them. A lot of them were unhappy with
[25:34] the type of law that they ended up
[25:36] having a job in was also another
[25:40] hint for me. And just not wanting to
[25:44] work all the time that mattered to me. A
[25:48] lot of them didn't have families or the
[25:50] stereotypical going through divorce or
[25:52] they had a family that they never saw.
[25:54] Those are all things that you think are
[25:57] not frequent and they may not be. There
[26:00] could be well-balanced lawyers, but from
[26:02] my information, my interviews, that was
[26:05] not seen. And I knew that is not the
[26:09] life I wanted to live.
[26:09] I actually did not know all this about
[26:12] lawyer. I never considered that field.
[26:15] I mean, I think it's cool. The precision
[26:18] in the way you communicate
[26:20] that's required to be a lawyer is so me.
[26:25] and to fight the good fight is so me. So
[26:31] everything about being a lawyer I would
[26:33] love except the not having Yeah. and the
[26:38] not having a work life balance, the some
[26:41] of them feeling they lost their soul
[26:44] being a lawyer.
[26:46] And that's just not what I want. Why
[26:48] would you do that if you know they said
[26:50] you could potentially lose your soul?
[26:53] and being unhappy but you spent so much
[26:55] time, money, effort to do.
[26:59] So after that realization
[27:01] Oh, and
[27:03] sorry. Okay.
[27:03] No, no, no. Like yeah, after that
[27:05] realization I said no. So I went into
[27:08] business. I have my BA in business
[27:11] management. Business administration
[27:13] with international business.
[27:15] Um specialize in international business
[27:17] and what is the second one? Business
[27:19] management. So how did you find that you
[27:21] should do that?
[27:23] I love cultures. I originally after I
[27:26] realized not being a lawyer, I worked a
[27:29] lot of retail jobs in early 2000 and a
[27:32] lot of them were going abroad to start
[27:36] their expand their retail company. So I
[27:38] wanted to continue in my retail world,
[27:41] my love of clothes and fashion
[27:43] and my previous experience of being in
[27:45] retail. I wanted to help those companies
[27:48] on their expansion to new countries. I
[27:52] loved culture. I loved retail and I
[27:54] wanted to be a part of that. So
[27:56] international business and then
[27:59] management because someone has to
[28:00] organize all of this work. International
[28:02] business with management.
[28:04] So what happened then?
[28:06] Then I traveled and I realized I don't
[28:09] want to live in these places. I just
[28:12] want to vacation there. I don't want to
[28:14] live there. So, you went outside the
[28:17] country?
[28:17] Yeah, just small travels. Like the one
[28:19] company was Express and they were
[28:21] thinking about going to the Bahamas and
[28:23] the Caribbean islands. And of course,
[28:25] living in Florida, going to the
[28:26] Caribbean is very cheap. So, I was going
[28:28] on different cruises and flights and
[28:29] going to school in Miami at FIU, a lot
[28:32] of your classmates are international.
[28:34] So, just going with them to their home
[28:36] country and just being like a local
[28:38] there was very w like eyewakening.
[28:42] and I realized I don't want to live. I
[28:44] just want to visit. So
[28:47] So then what did you find?
[28:49] So then I graduated and I got my first
[28:54] job with TTI as a field sales
[28:58] coordinator or field sales
[28:59] representative. And what that is is
[29:02] purely sales. And I worked TTI is a
[29:06] power tool manufacturing company. Yes.
[29:10] Fancy. a power to. So if you ever go to
[29:12] Home Depot and you buy a Ryobi,
[29:16] Homelight, Rigid,
[29:18] Hoover, Dirt Devil,
[29:20] that's the company I worked for. One
[29:22] company manufactures all of those
[29:23] products. So I was the field sales
[29:27] representative for that company within
[29:30] Home Depot. So I was the liazison
[29:32] between TTI and Home Depot for all their
[29:35] product lines. So then from there I got
[29:38] a promotion to the parent company which
[29:41] is Milwaukee power tools another power
[29:43] tool manufacturing company sales. I'm
[29:46] very good at sales.
[29:48] What was your job then
[29:50] with Milwaukee tool?
[29:51] For Home Depot.
[29:52] I didn't work for Home Depot.
[29:54] I mean when you was there
[29:55] field sales representative so I was a
[29:57] liazison. So I was required to make sure
[30:00] product was in good standing like
[30:02] inventory presentation. Sometimes Home
[30:05] Depot will want their vendors to do
[30:08] product demos. So if a Home Depot was
[30:11] wanting a product demo for any of those
[30:13] brands, that would be my call for within
[30:16] my territory. And I would have between
[30:19] five to eight Home Depot that were
[30:21] within my require like my territory to
[30:23] make sure that Home Depot knew who their
[30:26] liaison was. Product was stocked,
[30:28] product was out, demos were scheduled if
[30:31] the store wanted it, numbers were up per
[30:35] like growth was at least 20% because
[30:37] that's what that company expected of all
[30:39] of their brands.
[30:40] Monthly, quarterly, yearly. monthly, you
[30:44] had to at least be up 20% in all of your
[30:46] brands.
[30:47] That's possible.
[30:48] It's possible when you work hard. It
[30:50] takes a lot of work. This is sales. Got
[30:52] to earn it. Um, but yeah, that was my
[30:55] job. So, TTI, then I got promoted to
[30:57] Milwaukee. Um, in Milwaukee, I also was
[31:01] the liazison within Home Depot at that
[31:04] point. No, Milwaukee. It wasn't Home
[31:06] Depot. It was non Home Depot
[31:09] distribution centers. So like mine was
[31:12] industrial construction. So think stores
[31:14] you would never know like city electric
[31:16] mom and pop hardware stores that are
[31:18] just people that decide to sell. But
[31:20] yeah, but only for Milwaukee as their
[31:22] liaison for power tools.
[31:24] And again going back to Home Depot, you
[31:27] had one Home Depot that you was attached
[31:29] to or multiple?
[31:30] I had multiple. It my territory changed
[31:32] between five to eight
[31:34] Home Depots at one time within an area.
[31:37] And this is when I lived in New Jersey.
[31:41] You know, this is what I love about this
[31:42] interview.
[31:43] What?
[31:44] I've been working with you for two
[31:45] years. I did your interview.
[31:47] Mhm.
[31:48] I still did not know this deep about you
[31:52] your this experience
[31:54] that I had sales experience and I know a
[31:56] whole bunch about power tools and
[31:59] Yes. Yes. Yeah. I mean, I'm always open.
[32:02] It was really interesting and you make a
[32:04] lot of money with sales and um
[32:06] but I tell people like well fen like
[32:08] it's sales you can make a lot of money
[32:10] with sales why did you decide to leave
[32:12] not who I wanted to be I did feel like I
[32:15] was losing my soul and then it was just
[32:18] compounded I felt like I had reached a
[32:20] glass ceiling the company wasn't what I
[32:22] wanted it to be and how I wanted to be
[32:25] treated and I just realized sales is
[32:28] something that I'm good at not what I
[32:30] enjoy. So, it was something that I knew
[32:33] was basically a ticking time bomb of
[32:35] like what do I enjoy about being in
[32:39] sales that kept me in this job so long?
[32:41] Because there are aspects that brought
[32:42] me joy and realizing those joys that
[32:46] those items that brought me joy and what
[32:48] other jobs or careers can give me that
[32:51] same joy and use those same skills.
[32:54] Yeah. So then from there I went into
[32:59] sales operation coordinator
[33:02] for a rental company, a rental
[33:04] construction company, Synergy Equipment
[33:07] local. And there again, it was less
[33:10] sales. It was more working with your
[33:12] customers, helping them identify what
[33:15] equipment they needed, but still very
[33:17] salesheavy and construction. And I
[33:19] didn't feel like,
[33:21] yeah, I'm good at power tools. I can
[33:23] work a drill. I can cut some stuff. I
[33:24] can build some stuff. I can do it. But
[33:27] is that who I am? No. So it was like I'm
[33:30] getting more to the truth of Fen. That's
[33:33] when you're talking about today in our
[33:35] fireside like finding out who are you.
[33:38] It definitely takes years. Like when
[33:40] people say they realize it in a couple
[33:42] months. Um it's it's insincere to me. It
[33:45] takes time and a lot of self-awareness
[33:48] and growth and reflection of like, okay,
[33:51] this is what happened. What did I get
[33:53] out? It takes time. So it takes time. So
[33:57] from there I had my internal
[34:01] scrum master job with ACI agile
[34:03] continuous and integration. Integration
[34:05] and with ACI that's
[34:06] how did you get into that though
[34:07] with ACI?
[34:09] Yeah that job
[34:10] with the internal scrum master with ACI
[34:12] my agile mentor Leanda.
[34:15] So I met her at an agile meetup
[34:19] connected. She was like, "Yeah, you seem
[34:21] like the type of person that could do
[34:25] this." And I had heard about agile from
[34:27] my mom. So it was like perfect.
[34:31] So you have no knowledge or experience?
[34:32] No, I had heard about it from my mom.
[34:34] Knowledge but training or
[34:36] nothing at that point. Nothing. It was
[34:38] like I heard about it. My mom convinced
[34:40] me to go to some agile meetups. I said
[34:43] sure. Then I met this woman. She's like,
[34:46] "Yes, you seem like the type of person
[34:48] that would be a great scrum master." All
[34:51] of the things. And then that's when she
[34:55] said, "Invest in yourself." I paid for
[34:58] the class, took the class, learned it,
[35:01] got through it, got my certification.
[35:04] Then from there, going, like I said
[35:06] before, going to the different agile
[35:08] meetups and just honing your skill. If
[35:12] this situation, what would I do as a
[35:15] scrum master? What should a scrum master
[35:17] do? Talking to people in the industry,
[35:20] what is appropriate? What is not
[35:22] appropriate? What are people currently
[35:24] doing? What did people used to do in
[35:26] this job that people don't do anymore in
[35:28] this job? All of the nuances to just
[35:31] learn. Be a sponge. Yes. So then again,
[35:36] I'm internal scrum master. But what do
[35:37] you
[35:37] mean by being a sponge?
[35:38] Being a sponge. Soak it in. Soak in what
[35:42] people are trying to help you by telling
[35:44] you. I would say for lack of a better
[35:47] people, American culture, there's a
[35:51] reason to not be a sponge. To come into
[35:53] situations like I already know.
[35:56] Mhm.
[35:56] You shouldn't be that way at all times.
[35:58] Be a sponge. Humble yourself to be
[36:01] receptive for information.
[36:03] And I think that's the best place to be
[36:06] as a scrum master, as a person, and in
[36:08] life. Yes.
[36:10] So internal scrum master honing the
[36:13] agile coaches preparing their trainings
[36:16] preparing their conference presentations
[36:18] and then that was also when I was
[36:21] working part-time as an internal cuz I
[36:23] was doing stay at home mom life cuz I
[36:24] had just had a baby so it was perfect
[36:26] for me. It was remote. It was part-time.
[36:29] I could hone my skills. It was perfect
[36:31] job for me. And then I said I'm ready
[36:33] for more. My son's about to be 15 18
[36:35] months. And I started applying for jobs
[36:37] and found health. No, Aventel didn't
[36:39] find I didn't find out that a recruiter
[36:41] find me and said I was perfect for
[36:42] Aventel. That was what happened.
[36:46] And you was perfect for us.
[36:48] I think Avent's lucky to get you to have
[36:50] you.
[36:51] Thanks.
[36:51] Honestly,
[36:52] add value. at least a scrum master could
[36:54] do is add value
[36:56] and um
[36:58] I don't know how you feel about your
[37:00] prior experience but I think um all
[37:03] those experience
[37:06] um the real life experience of working
[37:09] at different places I think uh that make
[37:13] you even more stronger when it comes to
[37:15] the sense of the business
[37:18] because the way Advent Health work is
[37:23] um they have a business, they're driving
[37:25] business and some of the time we have to
[37:27] understand and you do a great job with
[37:30] that is um um we sacrifice process
[37:38] uh scrum many time
[37:40] don't tell people
[37:41] to deliver right
[37:44] yes
[37:44] but but we come back and and so the top
[37:49] thing that is in my head is how we go
[37:52] back on March 15, how we go back to more
[37:57] normal and uh pick up the thing that we
[38:01] were missing for last 2 3 6 months.
[38:04] I agree. I agree as working here. Yes,
[38:08] that is something you have to get used
[38:10] to. You have to understand, accept and
[38:14] adapt to. So I agree with you. Yeah. And
[38:17] and I really like that you have that
[38:19] business sense that uh if we are doing
[38:24] this and it
[38:27] something for the business and impact
[38:30] you you able to understand that impact
[38:33] and and rec empathize with it.
[38:38] Yes.
[38:39] You you did say twice uh about losing
[38:44] your soul.
[38:46] What that mean?
[38:48] Losing my soul means losing my identity
[38:51] of who I am, what are my morals, what is
[38:55] my standard for a job or for money. That
[39:00] is losing my soul. Like being true and
[39:04] honest and telling you that something is
[39:08] not going to happen.
[39:11] Not being able to say that to me is
[39:13] losing my soul. If I can't tell someone
[39:16] this is crazy, you are crazy, this is
[39:19] unrealistic
[39:21] and I have to hold that back, that is me
[39:24] losing my soul a little bit. When I was
[39:26] speaking specifically about being a
[39:28] lawyer is when you learn in debate
[39:31] sometimes you have to advocate and
[39:35] defend a cause, purpose, person,
[39:37] whatever that you disagree with. And
[39:41] some would say to be a good lawyer means
[39:43] you can argue both sides and win, which
[39:46] is true. That's what it is to be a good
[39:48] lawyer. To me, I would feel like I'm
[39:52] losing my soul and having to fight,
[39:54] defend, advocate for something that I
[39:57] don't agree with. And depending on where
[39:59] you work, who you work for, however your
[40:01] situation is, that may happen to you.
[40:04] And I didn't even want to put myself in
[40:05] that situation to have to fight for,
[40:09] defend, advocate for a cause that I
[40:12] don't agree with. I would feel like I
[40:14] was losing my soul in that aspect. When
[40:16] it came to sales,
[40:19] I enjoy talking to people. I enjoy
[40:22] showing people the value of the product
[40:24] that I work for. Like working for those
[40:26] power tool companies, they were great
[40:28] tools. They add value for specific
[40:31] customers. But I had people in my life,
[40:34] managers in my life that they would say
[40:37] they wanted me to push harder to close
[40:39] the deal. I felt I was pushing harder to
[40:43] force a customer to buy something they
[40:45] don't need or want. And then the reverse
[40:48] would say, "No, you didn't force anyone
[40:50] to do anything. They always have the
[40:53] choice."
[40:55] How many times do you feel like someone
[40:57] pressured you into buying something?
[40:59] That is when I felt like I could be
[41:01] losing my soul. I know you don't need
[41:03] this, but I have a job to push you to
[41:07] buy the most expensive tool in my deck
[41:11] or a new product that I know you don't
[41:14] need, but it's my job to push you into
[41:16] buying this product. People would say
[41:19] advocate, advise, make awareness of at
[41:23] the end of the day, you are buying
[41:26] something that you may not need
[41:30] and that doesn't make me feel warm and
[41:32] fuzzy. So, it's not something that I
[41:34] wanted to do.
[41:36] I don't know if you realize this about
[41:38] you, but you're so clear.
[41:41] You're so clear about what you
[41:43] I wanted to be a lawyer. I wanted to
[41:45] again words precision in your words
[41:48] basis of being a good lawyer. Precision
[41:50] in your words and intention. You got to
[41:53] learn it because that's how you can get
[41:55] caught up and not be a good lawyer.
[41:58] Right. But I'm not saying how well
[42:00] you're articulating. I'm saying how well
[42:03] you know your inner side of yourself.
[42:06] Oh, time.
[42:08] It takes time and like meditation.
[42:12] You articulate very well. I'm not saying
[42:14] that's great but you know your your
[42:17] inner side and then you articulate it
[42:19] really well. I mean
[42:21] you were saying
[42:22] meditation meditation and just time
[42:25] within yourself. However you meditate
[42:28] wherever you meditate what helps me is
[42:31] just time within myself to think about
[42:35] my dayto-day my life the decisions that
[42:38] I made have to make and what it means to
[42:41] me help me grow within myself
[42:45] that's it.
[42:48] Do you do that daily? How how
[42:52] what that looked like?
[42:54] Nothing specific. I would say
[42:57] finding I would say in the past it was
[43:00] forced intention
[43:02] to self-reflect. Forced intention to say
[43:06] I'm going to sit here and reflect back
[43:09] on the day, the decisions that I've
[43:11] made,
[43:12] what is my path and how I feel about my
[43:15] decisions. intentional like I remember
[43:18] setting intentional time driving in my
[43:21] car with no place to go. But at that
[43:24] point in my life, driving is what gave
[43:27] me a time to focus with no
[43:30] interruptions.
[43:32] Now, I would say any moment is a moment
[43:36] to self-reflect. Whether you're in a
[43:39] car, whether you're taking a shower,
[43:42] whether you're washing dishes, cooking
[43:44] dinner,
[43:46] anytime. But that didn't happen
[43:48] overnight. It was intentional of like
[43:51] mundane. How was my day to okay, how was
[43:56] my feelings? What did are the ripple
[43:58] effects of that decision? How am I
[44:00] feeling about that decision? And how
[44:02] does that affect the people around me?
[44:05] Things like that. So we we covered the
[44:08] journey part last two things right.
[44:12] So
[44:14] how do you discover your dreams and
[44:18] goals?
[44:21] By identifying what's my long term.
[44:26] I don't say I want this. The way I
[44:28] realize is what do I want in the future?
[44:33] Which is kind of like what you asked
[44:34] like how do I identify my dreams? But
[44:35] those are my current dreams. I identify
[44:38] my current dreams by what do I envision
[44:40] my future? So example,
[44:44] how do I envision my life to be when I'm
[44:47] 60? That's what's been riding my plate
[44:50] right now. How do I envision my life
[44:52] when I'm 60? Well, what do I want my
[44:55] date my average day to look like? I want
[44:58] to have my home in Florida. I also want
[45:01] to be able to live in Thailand for three
[45:04] months in my Thailand condo and or I
[45:08] want to be able to be on my land in
[45:12] Colorado and just be free. That is how I
[45:15] see my life cuz at 60 I'm a millennial.
[45:19] Can't know if you tell but I'm a
[45:21] millennial and the government says that
[45:24] social security will not be around for
[45:26] millennials. we will not be able to use
[45:28] social security as part of our income
[45:30] for retirement. So that tells me I can
[45:33] only live off of my money from working
[45:36] that day hand like hand-to-mouth or
[45:40] savings or 401k.
[45:43] So I need to lower my debt and how can I
[45:46] live off my 401k? Mhm.
[45:49] So, in identifying that I don't want to
[45:51] work till I'm 67,
[45:53] how am I going to prepare for my life
[45:56] for when I'm 60?
[45:58] How am I going to do that? By saving,
[46:01] buying my properties now, by paying off
[46:04] my debt now, so I can not have to work
[46:09] to pay for my daytoday by the time I'm
[46:12] 60. Because I don't see myself working
[46:14] till I'm 60. I really don't. I just I
[46:17] want to enjoy life and I hope I'm
[46:20] physically able to enjoy life by the
[46:24] time I'm 60. You just never know.
[46:26] But I but I also want to add that uh you
[46:31] are one of the very balanced person. So
[46:33] you're not waiting for 60. You you're
[46:36] taking time off all the time and uh
[46:39] being with the family. So
[46:41] you think I take work off all the time?
[46:46] All the time.
[46:48] All the time meaning continuously.
[46:52] Regularly.
[46:53] Yes, I do. I do.
[46:55] All the time.
[46:56] Yes. I do take days off because you have
[46:58] to
[46:59] especially Saturday, Sunday.
[47:02] Yes. Yes. That is family time.
[47:04] Family.
[47:05] Yes.
[47:05] Not like me who
[47:07] But I also have a young child.
[47:10] Yeah. I have
[47:10] the family.
[47:11] Yeah. I have a young child. I have my
[47:13] husband. We're still considered newly
[47:15] weds cuz we've only been married 5
[47:16] years. So, and he's in nurse
[47:19] practitioner school. So, beyond my own
[47:22] job, it's supporting my husband to make
[47:24] sure he graduates nurse practitioner
[47:25] school. And then I'm an only child and
[47:28] an only grandchild. So, then it's being
[47:30] available for my mom, for my
[47:32] grandparents. So, that matters to me.
[47:36] Yeah.
[47:37] And I was just saying that I spend a lot
[47:39] of time during the weekend to edit
[47:41] videos. But your kids are older. They're
[47:44] like, "Oh, I want to hang out with my
[47:45] friends. I don't want to hang out with
[47:47] you." You know, they're older, you know?
[47:50] Who knows what I'll be doing? I'll
[47:51] probably be flipping houses when
[47:53] Keegan's a teenager and saying, "Kegan,
[47:55] you're going to virtual school this year
[47:57] and I bought a property in Timbuktu and
[48:00] we're going to be gutting and flipping
[48:01] this house. Why you go to virtual
[48:03] school?" You know what I mean? That's or
[48:06] you know I imagine when Keegan's older
[48:09] and if he has the personality that we
[48:12] have Richard and I envision like living
[48:15] abroad like if Advent Health stays
[48:16] remote Richard can nurse FMP nurse
[48:19] practitioner anywhere as long as you're
[48:22] they accept your life center. So to me
[48:24] like we could be living in Spain. Can
[48:27] you imagine? I can imagine Keegan going
[48:30] to Spain, going to school in Spain or
[48:33] virtual class in the USA while we live
[48:35] in Spain and Country Hop. That is how I
[48:38] see my life.
[48:43] I'm happy like, oh, I could be living in
[48:45] Spain,
[48:47] you know. Yeah. Or, you know, Metha's
[48:50] like, yeah, come stay at my family
[48:52] house. I'm like, oh my gosh, I can Yeah.
[48:55] I'm like, that sounds amazing to me.
[48:57] It's been a couple weeks.
[49:00] Yeah. And she's like, "Yeah, this house
[49:03] and all this and you're gonna love it
[49:04] and people are super hospitable."
[49:07] You can't ask for any other situation
[49:10] when going abroad. You can't ask for a
[49:12] better situation.
[49:14] Yes. I say I'll focus.
[49:17] That is a great discussion. Um, what is
[49:20] your time management?
[49:23] Like in what way?
[49:24] Well, did we say goal setting? Okay. So
[49:26] you you identify your dreams, right?
[49:29] Um
[49:30] how do you convert or how do you pick
[49:32] the top things and how do you convert
[49:34] them into goals?
[49:36] Um and how do you execute your goals?
[49:39] So my husband read a book by some man.
[49:41] It was like your five out of your 25.
[49:44] Have you heard about this?
[49:45] So you write down all your goals,
[49:49] 25 goals.
[49:50] Oh yeah.
[49:51] And then you pick the top five. And then
[49:53] within the top five, I like to like what
[49:56] is it called? The avalanche method. Like
[49:59] they use it for paying off your debt.
[50:00] The avalanche method where like you have
[50:02] your 25, you have your five and then you
[50:05] focus on you prioritize that five and
[50:07] whether it be financially based or
[50:09] savings based, you focus on that to then
[50:13] pingpong to the next one. So basically
[50:15] just prioritizing in simplest form. So
[50:17] pick write down your 25, focus on your
[50:20] five and go from there.
[50:22] That's it.
[50:23] That's what you guessed too.
[50:24] Mhm.
[50:26] And and I'm assuming you and Richard
[50:28] both agree upon those.
[50:29] No, we have separate lists.
[50:31] Oh, okay.
[50:32] Yeah. Because his dreams are not my
[50:35] dreams. My dreams are not his dreams.
[50:37] They can be blended.
[50:39] Mhm.
[50:39] But neither really me. I did not want
[50:43] him to feel that my dreams had to become
[50:46] his dreams in a sense of me wanting
[50:50] acreage in Colorado. If that is not his
[50:53] dream, that is fine. That is nothing
[50:57] wrong with that. I want that for myself.
[51:00] I see the value in that. And that could
[51:02] be something that I go with with my mom,
[51:05] my grandma, or my girlfriends. I didn't
[51:07] want him to feel that he had to be a
[51:10] part of that financial burden of what
[51:13] was my dream to have that property. So,
[51:16] that's an example of a separation of
[51:18] goals. But, I mean, as a husband and
[51:20] wife, we do have our communal goals of
[51:23] like redoing the pool or, you know,
[51:26] paying off Keegan's college prepaid.
[51:29] Those communal goals are there, but we
[51:32] do also have our separate goals.
[51:34] Okay.
[51:36] And then your time management method
[51:39] when it comes to professional as being a
[51:40] scrum master.
[51:41] Well, this is the part where I mostly
[51:46] talk about the personal.
[51:47] Okay.
[51:48] But uh you can include how you manage
[51:52] your day time but mostly like your
[51:55] overall day.
[51:57] So as a person my time management
[52:01] it's more task management. Mhm.
[52:05] In a sense that right now my task
[52:08] management is focused on helping my
[52:10] husband graduate. All of my side
[52:12] projects, side intentions and goals have
[52:15] been put on hold to intentionally help
[52:17] my husband graduate. That is what my
[52:20] goal is to help him graduate, afford to
[52:22] pay for school and cash and to get that
[52:24] to done. That is what my focus is. Um,
[52:29] as a person, time management from being
[52:32] in sales,
[52:33] we feel like we never have a work life
[52:35] balance. In sales, you never have a work
[52:38] life balance. If a customer calls you or
[52:40] an account calls you, you answer that
[52:43] phone call. If they need you to create a
[52:45] business plan, you make that business
[52:48] plan. If it means you closing that deal
[52:50] and making that additional, you do it.
[52:52] So from having those jobs and not having
[52:56] a work life balance, opening the laptop
[52:58] at 5:00 in the morning, closing the
[53:01] laptop 10, 11, 12:00 at night, that is
[53:05] not the life I want to live. So I
[53:08] intentionally make an effort now to
[53:10] close my laptop at 4:30, 5:00. Like what
[53:14] is the saying? There will always be
[53:16] work. There will always be work. And if
[53:18] it was that important, someone will call
[53:21] you.
[53:23] someone will call you if it's that
[53:24] important. So that is my work life
[53:27] balance now. Efficiency during the day
[53:30] and closing the laptop at a consistent
[53:32] time and it also builds routine for the
[53:35] people around you like
[53:37] is always available during this window
[53:39] but I know that she's not intentionally
[53:41] available after this window. So it
[53:44] builds routine predictability with the
[53:46] people around you.
[53:49] But what after four or five? So your
[53:52] overall day um your personal goals. So
[53:56] how do you manage the time around that?
[53:59] Like my like goals like
[54:00] Do you do you have a a physical list or
[54:04] do you have
[54:04] Yes, I do. I have a physical list of my
[54:07] top five my top five family goals and
[54:10] then my own personal goals. They're
[54:12] literally on papers, like little post-it
[54:14] on front of my desk to remind me to make
[54:17] conscious decisions of what my goals and
[54:19] intentions are. Example, perfect example
[54:22] today.
[54:23] So, saving up for the down payment for
[54:26] my Colorado property. I'm actually ahead
[54:28] of the game, but that's my personal
[54:29] goal.
[54:30] So, I was like, wo, it's payday Friday.
[54:33] Let's go out to lunch, Fen. Treat
[54:35] myself, me, myself, and I. And I didn't
[54:39] because I saw the postit of my intention
[54:41] and goal of getting enough money for my
[54:44] Colorado property and I didn't. I ate at
[54:46] home and I'm a city girl. I don't like
[54:49] eating at home. I like to go out to eat.
[54:51] And I made lunch at home to save myself
[54:55] money to save for the down payment of my
[54:58] Colorado property. Things like that.
[55:00] That is happening.
[55:02] It Oh, it is happening. I can show you
[55:04] the Zillow postings. I can tell you my
[55:08] plan to meet my minimum requirements for
[55:10] my down payment. What I want to do with
[55:13] this property once I own it. Like
[55:17] what is the saying? Speak it into
[55:19] existence. Like I'm it is existing. It
[55:23] exists in my mind. Like I know what
[55:25] property, what are the minimum
[55:26] requirements of my property, where what
[55:29] I need to do to make the down payment,
[55:31] what I'm going to do with it once I get
[55:32] it. It is an attention. What is the
[55:35] saying? All other things are creatable
[55:38] but there's only a certain amount of
[55:39] land.
[55:41] Moving to the last segment. Okay. But
[55:43] before I do that,
[55:45] is there any question that I did not ask
[55:47] and you want to answer?
[55:49] No, I think
[55:50] any question any question for me?
[55:53] I don't think I have time for that. It's
[55:55] 50.
[55:57] But no, for today I'm good.
[55:59] Okay. So, what is your message to the
[56:02] audience?
[56:05] My message to the audience
[56:08] is
[56:10] push for what you want.
[56:12] Don't be aggressive, but push and
[56:14] advocate for what you want. If you want
[56:17] it, eventually it may come. May come. Be
[56:22] humble.
[56:24] Ask for support and for help.
[56:29] And just be a good person. Be a good
[56:31] person. That's it. Thank you so much Fin
[56:35] coming for this interview for this
[56:37] discussion. I think this discussion will
[56:39] help many people whoever is watching. Um
[56:44] I hope so. Thank you. Yeah, it was